Originally Posted by
NutLoose
Camelspyder, personally I think it is disrespectful to the men and women that put themselves in harms way to expect a medal when one doesn't.
As the RPA pilots wings are I believe edged in blue to show they are not real pilots as such, perhaps a blue rosette or blue letters RPA on the ribbon and medal would appease you to show that they were not won / earned in theatre. Will you now wish DFC's AFC's awarded to RPA pilots who are in no danger what so ever?
I cannot understand your point about the 365 10 years in service, the same could be said about the lowest LAC / SAC sitting at Brize maintaining the bridgehead, does he not deserve equal parity? As put by Legofan "overworked, massively stressed and underrecognised for their contributions" there are plenty more trades in the RAF under the same situation.
The main thrust here is that the debate shouldn't be a fight between different groups about who shouldn't get something as that just causes angst and ill feeling. It should be more about what more should people physically at the front-line (significantly less than the approx 3600 people eligible for the OS medal btw) - i.e. an additional bar/rosette - rather than what people absolutely directly part of the air campaign (that includes people flying a physical aircraft in theatre - RPAS crew) should not get...and I would agree that those at the next tier who support the people directly taking part in the campaign should also get recognition.
I see most people have identified your opinions are based on a lack of factual info/misinformed/ill-informed (whichever), however, some of your worst lines need correction IMO:
Very very few of the currently eligible OS Medal personnel are anywhere near front-line ops or risk/rigour criteria and therefore 'not in harms way' either (if you insist on sticking to the out-of-date and oversimplified legacy definition for a 'campaign' medal). Remember we are not talking about valour medals here. I would be pretty annoyed if I was techie in a supporting role in Cyprus fixing aircraft nowhere near front-line (no medal) compared to a techie in a supporting role that happens to be in Iraq fixing aircraft nowhere near front-line (medal). Army guys training troops nowhere near front-line ops....sound like the same role as training troops at home. Stats also tell you most accidents/injuries/deaths since Afghan happen in training not on Ops. The examples could go on...
Giving RPAS Pilots blue-edged wings was a fop to legacy thinking senior guys who couldn't get their head around new ways of operating aircraft/weapons systems. Doesn't make it right and it definitely doesn't make them 'not real pilots'. The only reason you don't think that is utterly insulting is because you (and others with no knowledge of the issues involved) think the 'blue wings' issue was done because they are 'different'. Where does that lead you...oh, I don't think a AAR Pilot is a real pilot either because his aircraft has way more autopilot functions than an RPAS so do they really ever 'fly' it anyway...I'm happy they are all real pilots btw (!) and intra-platform insults, beyond normal banter, gets us nowhere.
The 365/10 year in service thing was a bit of mis-quote. What he meant was 365/10 years operating an aircraft physically on Ops, in Ops, proving more kinetic/ISR support to the air/ground campaign than any other platform. So no, not comparable to any trade that is 'supporting' those flying aircraft physically in theatre. Again, based on complete lack of knowledge/awareness I'm afraid.
Yep, lots of pinch points in lots of trades therefore overworked, massively stressed and underrecognised for their contributions. None of the ones you mention are the supported asset on front-line doing all that whilst on ops and providing more than any other crew/platform for air support to grd campaign. So RPAS crews are not supporting a capability on ops - they are the ones providing that capability. As for 'kill chain' discussion the I'm afraid no-one you mention further back down the 'support' elements of the killchain are the ones pulling the trigger/approving the strike/guiding it in/responsible for it citing the right tgt and not killing anyone else etc. To quote otherwise is, again, ill-informed and incorrect. The line of determining who should get recognition for direct campaign air support is actually simple. For RPAS terms it includes the aircraft and the 'metal box' that houses the crew that fly it/operate it/employ kinetic strikes from it. They do much more than 6 sorties to 'earn' their recognition.