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Old 16th Feb 2017, 10:36
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slip and turn
 
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Yes noted Dave Reid, and that is just another reason why I say others including Simon may have access to a better (authoritatively recorded) picture. Fact is 267kts stands out as unexpectedly slow and 19800 unexpectedly high in whatever (short) real time period included those two reports, and the 20900 report from E1433 descending faster close behind.

As you can see, I do believe there's still good stuff to be learned from Monday lunchtime ten days ago at EIDW.

The big picture surely is that EIDW was busier than some pilots that day really set out to face. It wasn't just inconvenience of hold delays. It required a sharpening up of everyone on frequency. Not everyone was suitably resourced to be sharp enough soon enough to foresee all eventualities.

EAT's were not being volunteered for a time by ATC because the resource to calculate them appeared not to be instantly available e.g. "get back to you on that", "...someone behind me is just working on it" or words to that effect, and of course ultimately the "fifteen ahead" were heard a number of times. That alone created some uncertainty in all who were monitoring the frequency which they were forced to absorb and to immediately review with their own situation. The first clear EAT I heard (may easily have missed others) was one given some minutes after the traffic avoidance order. I remember that one was for an EAT of 1344. The traffic avoidance order occurred around 1310-1313? - I have no exact timings for the audio I have heard.

Consequently we assume, on hearing "fifteen ahead" a Ryanair whom we presume would be intimately familiar with EIDW seemingly announced "that's impossible" perhaps after realising that 15 x 2 minutes = 30 minutes or some similar rule of thumb, and diverted to Shannon after already mixing it with fast Dublin approach traffic. That of course was not ideal. Had they known more, and known earlier, they'd have presumably diverted earlier.

Fifteen ahead is a challenge at Biggin Hill on a sunny afternoon, but at a major airport with possibly questionable flow system (in my mind, I am finding it possible to question it!), there maybe better things to be learned.

But if better minds than mine who monitor EIDW flows on a daily basis have decided there is nothing to be learned, then all we can say is ok, maybe Monday lunch in Dublin is well worth preparing for especially if they're using 16 - better than tea no biscuits!

In closing, I think ten years ago and probably several time since, some of the general problem with flow control has been summed up quite well in this here thread on Descent Speeds!
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