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Old 1st Jan 2017, 21:34
  #76 (permalink)  
Lead Balloon
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Australia/India
Posts: 5,330
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The history of overruns led to adoption of the present philosophy.
This is why I find the responses to my scenario so interesting.

My 'take' on the introduction to the video, and your comment above, JT, is that the main safety issue was take offs that should have been continued rather than rejected, not vice versa. Yet when I give a scenario in which stopping action is initiated prior to or at V1, but the action fails, and the aircraft is now over V1, no one can bring themselves to say: Maybe the safer option is balls to the wall on the good engine/s and continue.

Let me change my scenario. Trundling down the runway the critical engine fails at V1. It is therefore not possible to intiate stopping action before or at V1. On my understanding of the collective expert wisdom, the decision must be to continue the take off - that decision having been made prior to or coincident with the critical engine failure at V1.

The only difference between the above and my original scenario is that the thrust levers were retarded at or before V1 in my original scenario.

Can I suggest that during the three seconds from the point at which the thrust levers were retarded until the thrust levers were advanced (amateur pilot Lead Balloon having realised the brakes were not working):

(1) the aircraft has exceeded V1

(2) the aircraft hasn't decelerated much, and is nearly as far down the runway as it would have been if the thrust levers for the good engine/s had not been retarded, and

(3) the good engine/s would not have spooled down that much and will spool back up to take off thrust 'quite quickly'.

However, I concede that number (3) is the critical variable. And this is where one of the points you (JT) made earlier becomes very important: Against which standard is the aircraft (and its engines) certified?

I can understand why spool up times would weigh heavily on the minds of the crews of e.g a B707. But 'modern big jet engines' are a little more responsive than P&W JT-3Ds - I posted the current FAR standard earlier.

For example, my understanding is that a version of the B777 will roll at 30kts with both engines at idle, unless the crew rides the brakes to keep the taxi speed down. My understanding is also that a B777 will take off and fly on one engine with the OAT 50c. Lessons learnt on B707s and early B747s may not be directly transferable to aircraft fitted with engines certified to the contemporary standard.

(And can I note how impressed I am with BaL's google skills? )
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