On and on we go, warries about LOP and Sled being left high and dry umpteen years ago! A error or mistake is one thing; an airspace system that allowed the lowest common denominator to determine the outcome of a conflict, with no requirement to announce their own position, is ludicrous, as was amply demonstrated at Launy.
But apparently that risk is 'objectively' acceptable for RPT in ForG in Australia, despite the clueless VFRs.
Err, yes, because the traffic levels are less (not to mention mandatory carriage and use of radio >5k, in a CTAF, mandatory use of Transponders if serviceable and in any case at all times above 10k, need I say more)! Traffic levels go up, a tower goes in. Guess what people, towers are for controlling. Ideally, you'd think aeroplanes would be talking to the tower. But no, no need to at Launy because it's Class E! See and Avoid rules, OK!
As for this nonsense...
Originally Posted by VRef+5
If my memory regarding the Launy is correct, the RPT jet was given the option to either turn left immediately for a RH downwind and base, or to overfly and join for LH downwind and base. The crew of the jet did not transmit precisely what there intentions were, and did their own thing (overfly for LH downwind). So they did not do themselves any favours, instead of being in an alerted see and avoid area, it became see and avoid only, based upon their actions
.
Surely you can't be serious, Shirley? How on earth can the Virgin 737 participate in Alerted See and Avoid if it didn't even know the Tobago was there? Alerted See and Avoid requires both parties to be involved. Clueless... Or we could just revert back to verbal diarrhoea as Dick had us doing around the circuit there for a while...
Originally Posted by Vref+5
So if the critics of the Launy incident do not want to see a repeat of that incident, then something has to be done with all of the aerodromes in Class G that are serviced by RPT. Mandating radio carriage in Class G isn't it, because a non radio aircraft is an aircraft which (1) doesn't have one fitted, or (2) is on the wrong frequency, or (3) volume is too low, or (4), or the PIC presses the map light instead of the transmit button, or (5) doesn't use it properly, or (6) the list goes on.
See my comments above. No-radio not permitted above 5k, ask the controller for a check call in Class G if you want, Beepback in CTAF to confirm. It's not that hard...
The mitigator has to be a third party, that's the whole premise of the ICAO airspace model. Risks becomes intolerable due to mix/volume, introduce another mitigator.
At Launy/Karratha, Broome, Alice, it's called a... Control Tower. At Ayers Rock, Port Hedland, soon to be Ballina, it's called a AFIS/CAGRO.
Originally Posted by Dick Smith
So our mandatory radio class G areas are clearly not F. !
That's what's so ridiculous about alphabet soup airspace. Trying to put labels on a setup that already exists and, given the chaos that has ensued since Dick embarked on his crusade in the 1990s, and the current state, largely unsuccessful (quite apart from probably driving pilots in their droves away from the pastime). We have, actually, achieved nothing. Nothing. Even though "everything" has changed, Nothing has changed. We still have a great airspace system. Simple, CTA and Non-CTA, mandatory radio when required, taking advantage of new technology eg transponders, ADS-B, beepbacks, auto-weather stations. Dick and Leadsled are really miffed can't fly their C150 through the arrival paths of the A380s going into Sydney using See and Avoid as the only method of separation, but then again, you can't ride a horse and cart on a freeway. Get real...