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Old 16th June 2003 | 18:21
  #114 (permalink)  
LEM
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Joined: May 2003
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From: The Roman Empire
There's a road with an 80 speed limit.
Ok, I think, if the limit is valid for an old driver, at night under the rain, why can't I, young and with quicker reflexes, during the day in good weather, increase that limit to 130?

We'll try to answer this question later on.


Everybody focused on the fuel aspect in this thread.
Those who focused on the planning stage were totally wrong: if you load the legal quantity, which must also include the extra LHR holding, you are right, safe and cannot be criticised.

Also those who focused on the fuel management at destination were not on target.
I assume you, Antigua, landed with at least final reserve that day.
It's perfectly legal to land with, say, 35 minutes of fuel left in your tanks.
It is also obvious that, if you have to go around, you will have to use part of the final res. fuel, thus you will have to declare an emergency.
All this is perfectly legal scenario, and you have declared an emergency because you are using even only a few minutes of you final res. fuel, that does't mean you are going to crash five minutes after the missed approach.

The real problem, that day, was in your request for more spacing:
the director was right in MORing you, not because you were not entitled to request more spacing, but just to obtain an official explanation from you.
Not the end of the world.

Heathrow depends on that infamous 2.5nm separation like life on this planet depends on oxygen.
If everybody requested more spacing without having to give an official explanation....


I know the true reason for your request was being behind an UzbekistansecondtimetoplanetearthTu154!

Had you been behind a BA737, I'm pretty sure you would not have made such a request.

Being a Great Captain, your assessment was realistic , and that's the point.
Is it fair to get the same separation behind an UzbekistansecondtimetoplanetearthTu154 and a BA737?
The realistic answer is NO!
And I'm totally with you in your realistic way of thinking.
Unfortunately, the society doesn't allow us to always be realistic: we are not allowed to say certain truths (having a deep experience of a certain continent, I know what I mean...)

I know that having tons of experience, knowledge and abilities, leads you to think you are entitled to behave more realistically than others, sometimes.
But when it comes to rules, it's a bit different: if everybody was allowed his personal interpretation of the rules, like in the speed limit example, a mess would result, albeit you are, realistically and logically, right!

The rule at LHR is 2.5 nm separation.
You have to accept that like everybody else.
If you have to go around you will declare an emergency and get priority for a quick return.
Perfectly legal (and CAA believes that legal means safe )!

I know (well, I assume, since you didn't declare an emergency) you didn't have a real fuel problem, and you just wanted to be cooperative in playing this crazy LHR game, but that raises a big question: are we allowed to be realistic? are we allowed to increase the speed limit because we are young, it's daylight and the weather is good? are we allowed to request more spacing because the preceding is a TU154?

In a better world, we would be.
Actually we can't, and we, the Great Realistic Captains in this case,have to find a way to obtain the same result cheating a little bit, since officially we can't say the truth.

Maybe the magic word is "appreciate ": it doesn't commit yourself like an official "request ", and if the controller is smart he will understand immediately, if not you will have to accept a slightly higher risk of a go around.
" We appreciate a few more yards behind the tupolev..." with the right voice inflection, should obtain the result, if you are lucky, without riskink a MOR.


LEM
a fluff-jet captain
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