Andrew M, I wasn't refering to you, but to a post made way back on page 1 of the thread.
However, now I am. You have demonstrated my point exactly. You say:
Also, they could get the real figures from somewhere - rendering the map shifting in sims useless.
You obviously don't know what a "map shift" is. Please go back and read my previous post.
QED.
By the way, I agree with you re PC sims and need for visual flight to target.