PPRuNe Forums - View Single Post - Thomas cook b757 incident, what a total mess
Old 14th Oct 2014, 09:59
  #100 (permalink)  
RAT 5
 
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Engine failures rarely happen nowadays, when they do it is rarely just before or after V1. Yet we always practice just that (some more enlightened companies also throw them in at other times.)

Time for XAA's to rethink their mandatory items. An engine failure before V2. I had one given to me at Go Round from an NPA. The G/A flap setting = V2 Vref, so this was deemed as to comply. It was an excellent opportunity to hone some skills. The surprise factor alone was worth a great deal. Even just at V2 on a takeoff as the gear is selected up. Both are bird strike territory and thus realistic. Between V1 & Vr is really a very small deal. There's no roll. At 50' you have to be sharp, just as the pax expect.

I go back to my basic point a few posts ago. Pilots should learn and be taught in-depth how to control the a/c and make it do what they want; by either manual raw data, manual with AFDS help or use of the MCP and automatics. They should then be allowed to use what ever system is available to achieve the required task as decided by the PF. I've flown for various airlines who all tried to re-invent the wheel. The SOP's all had various personal (CP) tweaks. The a/c were all built the same, all had the same kit, but were treated slightly differently. If in the moment of stress I was hesitant about my accurate memory of the current SOP I reverted to flying the a/c in a basic manner to achieve the task. That's because I understood and knew how to do it. Some people here say that a G/A from height with only a few 100' to level off is hard. Not it's not if you understand the a/c. I once flew B767 with an F/O who was making a teardrop outbound to turn in on an NDB. It was timed outbound with no DME; at night CAVOK with PAPI. It was a descending manoeuvre; no big deal. The MAA was 2500'. AT 1000' on finals it was obvious he was hot & high. Nothing was happening; he was fixated, so I suggested a G/A. At which point he slammed on full thrust and we rocketed skywards. With some exasperated coaching he managed to regain control of the V/S. The idea had been to retract to mid-flap setting fly a visual circuit at MAA and try again. On later discussion about how we ended up in that state his reply was, "you called Go Round, so I did what was normal." A B767 at light weight and full power is a rocket ship.
The other often heard claim about chaos waiting in the wings is a Go Round when above MAA. Agh! Disaster waiting to happen, we hear. There have been other calm voices on here whose first reaction would be to take a deep breath.
Good thinking, Batman. Then use the controls & AFDS as necessary to achieve the task required in a calm manner. Having confidence in understanding the /c and systems allows this. That is more important than practice. Practice is too often trained monkey repetition.
I flew with one company that insisted a G/A be completed 100% and then a re-brief made for the next attempt, even on a visual CAVOK day. It was not allowed, as was ably demonstrated one day by another airline, to climb out, retract flaps to a mid-setting, turn downwind into a visual circuit and land: all the while staying on tower frequency. Thus the G/A involved climbing up to a high altitude, changing to approach at another airfield, return to the beacon and start all over again. Thus, crews knew only one method of doing a Go Round. This was what was written down; they did not know, or have discretion, to use the necessary to achieve task efficiently and expeditiously.
So, when the G/A is commenced from an unfamiliar point they are lost. Sad days.
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