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Old 15th Jul 2013, 18:25
  #2144 (permalink)  
Lonewolf_50
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
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Tom: thanks for the reply, not sure why my post was deleted. Maybe it was too long.
suninmyeyes:
If you are low you raise the nose and the autothrottle adjusts thrust to control the speed unless it is in hold mode.
That seems to be the problem. Either the pilot adds power, or the A/T adds power (an automated feature, type dependent) but when low and slow there is a need for power to correct. Retired F4 named this pages ago: it is an energy management matter. Pilot (or an auto feature) adds energy via power (engines). Merely changing pitch does not add energy, it trades energy. If pilots are taught to fly the nose and the plane will take care of the power (because it seems that frequently, it is set up to do just that) then the root cause of an automation induced (assisted?) trap seems to be staring us in the face. (Granted, one can get low and slow in an aircraft without a bit of automation as well ... particularly if distracted ... )

In this respect, flying a visual approach in a heavy is no different than flying a King Air, with the major exception of response time. The pilot in a heavy has to be further ahead of the aircraft than the King Air pilot due to how long it takes to overcome inertia in landing configuration, at approach speeds, in the case that a correction is needed or a Go Around is required.

A similar comparison: driving a PT boat versus driving a Navy Destroyer. Response time / inertia: big difference.
If you have gear down flap 30 and idle power and are decelerating below Vref and you raise the nose then the rate of speed decay happens extremely quickly
From behind the power curve to further behind the power curve ... energy deficit.
Apart from practice in the simulator this was probably the first approach either Captain had done where the autothrottle did not maintain the Vref speed.
Aviation Week asks (July 15 2013 issue) Automation Paralysis?
The landing checklist was not completed until 500 feet.
Do you think this was due to accepting the 180/5 call from ATC?
Someone made a point on that early on in the thread.

Last edited by Lonewolf_50; 15th Jul 2013 at 18:37.
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