Originally Posted by fustall
This was the start of the problem,how did Airbus get away with fitting inferior pitot tubes with inferior heating elements?
Conditions that lead to pitots being overwhelmed could not be replicated in any test and, besides 1) are very rare 2) are of short duration 3) were successfully negotiated every time except once.
Originally Posted by Lonewolf 50
they made the assumption that stall warnings that they were receiving were spurious.
Could be, but then it is pretty widespread standard in airline cockpits to react to false warnings with "DISREGARD (reason) " and tell the significant cockpit other what you think is going on and what you are doing. I'd be surprised if AF didn't have similar procedure.
Originally Posted by Lonewolf50
I am not convinced that a 5 degree nose up pitch held ad infinitum would do other than slowly fly them into a stall, or slowly fly them to their service ceiling.
With idle power they would have stalled, with climb power they would have leveled off below service ceiling, at altitude where power required for 5° AoA steady flight meets power available delivered in CLB detent. Come on folks! Basic aerodynamics is not that difficult.
Originally Posted by jcjeant
why Airbus (in the first place) fitted those particular brand and patent (Thales) Pitot tubes ?
1.18.1.7.
Originally Posted by Lyman
I disagree, utterly. you would enlarge your understanding manifold once hearing evidence that is unfortunately unavailable to you, or to the public.
The CVR tells BEA everything, they tell us next to nothing. It is quite possible the CVR will find its way into the public domain. If available to you, would you listen? Or would you cover you ears, satisfied with a 'story'...
So you have access to CVR recording that is contrary to one published by BEA but you just can't share it with us or it is pure conjecture on your part that CVR transcript is inaccurate or worse?
Originally Posted by truckflyer
Furthermore to Airbus pilots, when did Unreliable Airspeed become a memory item?
Before first Airbus took to the skies. First item is KEEP ON FLYING on every aeroplane.
Originally Posted by truckflyer
should they have been aware of these procedures.
Should they have been aware of the emergency procedure on their aeroplane? Maybe we should ask pilots if that's what is expected of them.
Originally Posted by truckflyer
From what the TV program showed, however much is correct there I don't know, but it does seem like the PF (RHS) locked/jammed the controls for to long time!
Name of this thread is "AF447 report out". Stick traces are available in the said report.
Originally Posted by Lonewolf 50
Typically, airlines do not do actual stall training in the aircraft (valid risk and cost reasons),
Exactly. On my current type full stall would cost an aeroplane and lives of the crew. That's why we are never trained to recover form it but rather to prevent it.
Originally Posted by lonewolf50
That sort of training is apparently not done.
...yet some managed not to crash their 330/340s even without the training.
Originally Posted by Lyman
Lose no altitude
That's very interesting way to describe 7000 fpm zoom climb near the ceiling.
Originally Posted by Retired f4
Or you are talking about an aircraft, where autotrim is keeping the aircraft trimmed into the stall?
Autotrim works both way but stick has to be held forward long enough that elevator alone cannot meet the G demand.
Originally Posted by BEagle
That nonsense has now been canned - it was some FAA Examiners' idiocy which was totally wrong. Both Airbus and Boeing have now had to rewrite their stall recovery procedures to ensure that the emphasis is on reducing AoA. 'Unload for control' was once a well-known maxim; sadly that seems to have been forgotten by many.
It is not nonsense.
It hasn't been canned.
It's just folks around still can't tell the difference between approach to stall recovery and stall recovery. Unsurprising if one can't tell the difference between the stall warning and stall.
Originally Posted by BEagle
Control may be compromised if TOGA is applied as this can generate a powerful pitch/thrust couple which can exceed elevator authority if the aircraft has auto-trimmed to the point of the stall.
So what. If autopilot autotrimed, manual trim is available. If FBW autotrimed, stick forward causes trim to roll in the opposite direction.