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Old 3rd Sep 2012, 05:54
  #150 (permalink)  
tucumseh
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: uk
Posts: 3,226
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but the report is a string of separate issues, mentioned, but not drawn together in a coherent facts, conclusions, recommendations fashion.
Not unlike Haddon-Cave’s, except he deliberately omitted key, verifiable facts.




Navaleye - you got it right. The Haddon-Cave report was, I believe, pre-determined. I said so (here) long before he reported and I have not change my mind. He omitted the Organisational Faults and blamed the wrong people; thus misdirecting the efforts of the MAA for ever more.





John Farley

I feel this was history repeating itself and a very type related event that needed no explanation. Importantly there are no more of the type operating - so no lessons to pass on. Not all accidents are like that. That is why I would not compare it with other reports from the past that were written about some very puzzling accidents.

I guess all I am saying is nothing more profound than I don't see any need for all accident reports to meet a common standard.


I think this may be the first time I disagree with you. MoD UK regulations require the possibility of “Organisational Fault” to be addressed (as alluded to above). That makes the fact the type is no longer in service irrelevant.

What is wrong with the UK system is that the same “organisation” that may be at “fault” is the same one allowed to judge its own case. That is an even higher level Organisational Fault.





Chug is right to cite Mull of Kintyre. There can be no greater organisational fault than the officer responsible for signing the Master Airworthiness Reference doing so, while omitting the rather important facts that (a) the new fuel computers were functionally unsafe (in fact, "positively dangerous") and (b) operational flight was not authorised because there was no clearance whatsoever to use any Nav or Comms equipment. There are calls above for legal action - why not start with MoK?





There is much justified criticism here about this Lightning case, but the great irony is that for 25 years the MoD have deserved far worse. There is no evidence presented that orders were issued in SA to completely ignore their airworthiness regulations and make false declarations that they had been adhered to. Yet that is precisely what MoD staffs were ordered to do from 1988 to 2009 (in my experience). That is a awful lot of people who have been "trained" under such a regime.
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