DozyWannabe
Wouldn't you say it's a fairly minor issue compared to pulling 15 degrees nose-up when you're already at your cruise level?
All pilots make mistake, some die in the course of making mistakes because they are not able to recognize this and therefore canīt correct them. Therefore i cant agree to the term "fairly minor issue". Letīs say, if the pullup wouldnīt have occurred, we would have no reason to talk about it. But when **** happens, you should be able to recognize it and get the appropriate action going to save the day. Afterwards go to have coffe without cookies and tell others about your dumbness in hope, that they learn from you.
DozyWannabe
So is detection and recovery from stall, which they didn't manage.
Believe me, thatīs a completely different horse. The stall in the P149 and later in the T37 and in the T38 felt all different to the stall in the F4E, that one was different to the non-slatted RF4E, and the F4C with the inboard LE-Flaps again felt different. To recognize an stall when you dont expect it is a very challenging task. See the amount of LOC-events and then tell me otherwise.
DozyWannabe
The extra care can be boiled down to a single rule - stay within the flight envelope outside of Normal Law!
Thatīs a oversimplified version of cure. As i assume, that you drive a car, it would equal an advice to stay on the street to avoid hitting a tree along the road. Not very helpful despite being absolutely true.
DozyWannabe
It's an opinion you're welcome to, but to me it seems like an attempt to pin blame on an aspect of the design because of a pre-determined conclusion that you don't like the design.
Just stop the blaming thing, i didnīt blame anybody or anything and i do not intend to. I have no axe to grind over Ab or to favour B. iīm not on the paylist of either one. I donīt care who is manufacturing the aircraft which brings myself or my loved ones to Sardegna or another place of my choice, but i expect to reach my destination i paid for. As i was involved in training and evaluation of aircrews as well as contributing in accident investigations for the greatest part of my military career my interest lies in developping an understanding of the happenings, which led to this tragic accident. I do that by discussion and not by blaming.
DozyWannabe
Most of the in-depth knowledge was held by the Flight Engineer in the old days. I suspect that were you to show an old FE the layout of the Airbus systems they'd consider it child's play compared to what they had to deal with.
I agree, and it would be bad if it would be otherwise. The more i wonder, how little knowledge is present by the averageAB pilot (might also be the B pilot) concerning the basic stuff, we had to know in our times.
DozyWannabe
Not at all - what bothers me is that those harping on about the level of complexity either haven't flown the FBW Airbus, or have flown it despite having a pre-existing dislike of the design. There appear to me to be just as many current and former FBW Airbus pilots who don't find the design overly complex at all. They don't post as frequently, but they're definitely around.
Well, you havenīt flown it either, so we are even on that one. But what bothers me is, that there are thousands of AB pilots around and only less than a handfull still flying ones participated in this thread from the beginning. But those had been attacked as AB haters the same like those without or with limited AB expierience. The AB haters spelling is a defense line against any discussion sensible to the matter and is brought up not by the people attacking AB (there are a few), but by the self declared defendents of any system built into an AB aircraft. You may count anybody to the AB haters, but please donīt count me in.