Originally Posted by
Pace
.
BPF
I think you are missing my point! The PC12 was recorded in a descent rate of 10000 fpm so the aircraft was in some sort of spiral dive or dive before it broke up BUT that could have started as a stall /spin and developed into a spiral dive with the pilot believing he was in a spin!
Spins stalls spiral dives are in themselves irrelevant it is more about identification and feeling comfortable with what the aircraft may throw at you.
Part of the issue here is, I think one of definition. To be clear I am not against spin training. Quite the opposite. I think every licensed pilot should do an introductory aerobatic course and that it should be mandatory for instructors.
What I am against is spin training for the PPL. In particular where the plane is deliberately put into a spin and into spin controls are held until the spin is fully developed (ie more then 2 turns) and the spin recovery is "practiced". I think this is an utterly useless exercise at the PPL level.
The goal of PPL training should be to properly teach the foundation skills. Before you can fully understand the spin you have to be able to understand and control in slow flight and then in the approach to the stall and then into the stall itself.
These exercises are properly taught IMO with the emphasis on recognizing the signs of the impending stall and recovering from them before the airplane stalls. If the aircraft does stall then I think it is absolutely vital that the
instinctive and automatic reaction of stick forward, full power, and rudder to control yaw be inculcated.
Doing this requires a goodly number of practice stalls and helps to build the confidence in the student that he/she can maintain control of the aircraft and quickly recover even if they miss the signs of the impending stall. An emphasis on controlling yaw during the stall and subsequent recovery will prevent the stall from developing into an incipient spin and then proceeding to a full spin.
Personally I don't think "spin" training would have made any difference to the outcome of the PC12 crash. What he needed was "upset" training which is specifically designed to train a pilot to quickly regain control when the plane suffers an upset, which undoubtedly happened here. By definition utilizing upset recovery procedures will cause the aircraft to recover before it enters a fully developed spin or spiral dive.
As an experienced PPL/CPL/ME/IFR and aerobatic instructor I guess I have strong opinions on this subject based on what I have seen and done over the last 25 years. We seem to be opposite sides of this argument and so maybe it is time to just agree to disagree.
