As this forum is meandering far more than the main AF447 (thread 5) forum on the key issues, could we please not lose total focus? The industry is safer, and automation has played its part. The significance of AF447, and several other LOC incidents in recent years, is assessing where the industry currently is in the limited circumstances where pilots are left to their own devices. Aircraft are stopping pilots making many mistakes which could turn fatal, and I think most veterans would accept that, but can we say that many commercial airline pilots are ready to now suddenly be handed back manual control and ride to the rescue in the way most could once have done......? We are where we are through AF447, and it is not happy reading.