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Old 2nd Jul 2011, 02:03
  #36 (permalink)  
Lokfuhrer
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: birmingham
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jabird,

There is much in the swiss model for us to follow. Though i almost got caught out at a bus stop in a nice mountain valley south of Meiringen where the bus had to be 'reserved' in advance!

As for spotters and enthusiasts riding on maglevs, i'd love to have a bash on one. Maybe it'll be my excuse to go to shanghai, but many weekends you see people riding through the countryside on preserved steam trains. It doesn't make them spotters or even knowledgeable, just curious.

This thread has shifted away from Eurostar. Sorry for the part i've played in that. High speed rail is a creditable and real alternative to short haul travel in Europe and elsewhere. To the point that KLM have invested in the Dutch HS line toward Belguim (and hence Paris). The train has the market between Brussels and Paris. Lufthansa reserve whole carriages on some ICEs in Germany. But not so much for the UK regions. Manchester and Leeds to Amsterdam, Brussels, Cologne, Frankfurt, Geneva and Paris yes. but further afield and involving connections i think it takes a dedicated traveler to go by train, ie someone who likes trains, or hates flying, or wants an adventurous journey or stop off enroute. I went from Birmingham to Corfu by train and ship and loved every bit. Yet i still fly maybe 20 sectors a year because that suits me best at the time. My concern would be the that the price of such railway integration into europe would mean us joining Schengen area.

racedo,

I'll start you off with the first half billion of funding for HS2 by cancelling the rebuild of Birmingham New Street. the station may be a dump, but £500 million for a new facade and nicer waiting space for the same old crammed trains really is a rip off against the public. I like how you appreciate the motorways now they have already been built... and added to, and bypassed (M6 toll), though i accept the nation would have difficulty without them.

That you obviously don't understand how HS2 will provide benefits to commuters (along the transport corridor it shares) is a lack of understanding on your part and a serious fail on my ability to articulate those benefits. But consider that local trains at Birmingham New Street are regularly delayed to allow express trains to go first. A new dedicated HS route will provide tangible benefits for local travellers along the transport corridor towards BHX, Coventry and London. Those benefits will reach further north as HS2 goes towards Manchester and Leeds. Not to mention that taking longer distance passengers off of local routes/trains provides much more capacity for local services and will make local rail transport into those cities a much better experience than it is now in the peak, with the potential to operate more frequent local trains. Not worth 30 billion, but a benefit that would cost lots on it's own and remember that the EU has put down a challenging target for the reduction in CO2 emissions, local road transport is reaching saturation point and that public transport is safer. HS2s main selling point is saving a few minutes out of London to all points northwest of Birmingham. It's reality is the start of a high speed train evolution in the UK for all transport users. I just hope it can be integrated properly, though that's not a reason not to do it. As for the costs, it will provide some jobs. But the pressing problem in the UK is for costs to be cut, waste to be trimmed, bureaucratic none jobs slashed not a reduction capital investment. Why should it cost 30 billion. A line of comparible distance in Europe won't cost that much so why is it so expensive here? That's where HS2 should be targeted. The railway needs to reduce its costs (and the dubious costs enforced on it by stupid regulation) but not at the expense of the step change infrastructure investment.

Other benefits could arise from market share going from airlines to railways on the short haul routes could mean airlines operating a few different routes eg if Flybe stopped flying BHX to CDG maybe they'd put the aircraft on a route without railway competition which would increase the travellers overall choice of practical destinations. In 20 years time i don't see how airlines will be able to compete with high speed rail financially. Even though it maybe our taxes supporting the railway. I believe it better for tax to support the higher capacity people movers for the larger overall benefit.

I note that you find it easy to criticize these suggestions, you say there are current alternatives. Please share them with us. Not so that i can criticize you in return, but in order to share a greater understanding of the overall transport subject.
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