PPRuNe Forums - View Single Post - AF 447 Thread no. 4
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Old 1st Jul 2011, 08:08
  #608 (permalink)  
BOAC
Per Ardua ad Astraeus
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 18,583
PJ - you may elect to 'opt out' of the argument, but I will continue to press for a major change in attitudes for all, but particularly fbw system training. As I have said elsewhere, a lot of the current 'problems' derive from a mind-set based on 'promotional' talk and an apparent over-reliance on the ability to automate.

You say "you shrink the argument to Airbus system design, resisting every point of explanation regarding the "new" technology offered by those who actually know and fly the machine." No - I was equally critical of the 737 A/T failure at AMS and the 'training' involved. It seems to me that a Gallic shrug is all that is required when the software elects to automatically climb a 340 more than 2000 ft and reduce its speed towards Vls following turbulence and a minor overspeed detection. "It's OK, mes amis, we have changed the code" - not 'why is it designed that way'. Is the way we train our crews adequate for this system design? There has been no "point of explanation" about this logic, merely 'how it works' and not 'why?' Do I take it therefore that you find this 'reaction' acceptable? As for "you shrink the argument to Airbus system design", perhaps revisit the thread title?

As for 'gamers' operating modern aircraft, yes, we will go that way. Let's hope there are always enough tokens for them to put in the slots and that no-one ever pulls the power plug out of the wall.

For 'Smilin_Ed' also, would a competent pilot have zoomed a 340 to 380+ over the North Atlantic with a minor overspeed in turbulence? Most 'competent pilots' know full well that climbing a heavy aircraft from cruise and increasing towards a limiting alpha with turbulence is not a good idea. I would have hoped the designers thought the same way too and that pilots would have flagged this up. That is what I mean. I am not referring to 447. In my book, the jury is still out on the 'zoom climb'.

JD-EE, I disagree - it was the 'system' that trimmed the tail at AMS, PGF and with 447 (and several other cases), not the 'pilots'. In all cases they made no deliberate attempt to trim that far.
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