what should be expected of a low hour student.
Yes Big Pistons, I quite agree with you. I sometimes see (from the distance) quite a difference in flight instruction techniques, relative to what I know the aircraft should be expected to do. As I am not an instructor, and do not claim to have that skill, I will certainly defer to those pilots who are qualified to instruct. I'm not always at harmony with instructors, but I find I can always learn!
That said, we would all agree that low speed, and particularly asymmetric maneuvers, are the mosy risky. I find that there is a grey zone where we as pilots of more experience are morally bound to not encourage low hour pilots to go "exploring" these risks, but on the other hand, we bear some responsibilty for assuring that these low hour pilots are aware that the aircraft has been designed to behave well in these situations - to a point.
Right or wrong, (and I could be either) I think that new pilots can benefit from experiencing flight a bit beyond "the point", in a artificially safe environment. Hopefully it will be memorable for them in a way which will aid them in getting the most out of the plane when they need to, without creating unsafe situations, or being tempted to "fool around" later.
(And I realize I further thread drift here, pardon me!)
I consider Vmca training to have similarity to spin training in this respect. As I am certain that a low hour pilot should experience a one turn spin during training, I also feel that pilot (during ME training) should experience flight with only one engine developing power, where directional control can no longer be maintianed - just to see what it's like.
Without wanting to offend any instructor, I would state that if training of this type is not being done, because it is thought to be "too dangerous", that sends the wrong message to newer pilots. These maneuvers can be very dangerous, if flown in the wrong circumstances. But if planned, and executed carefully, should have a margin of safety which is acceptable. If that margin of safety is not acceptable because the instructor themself cannot safely recover the possible departure from controlled flight which
could result, that's a whole different problem, which, in my opinion, should not be a reason to not demonstrate. I certainly agree that a snap roll in a Seneca is a really bad occurance, but I know that the aircraft should be able to withstand it safely, if the recovery is reasonable. (apparently it can, thanks for the good flying Big Pistons!). I worry that there are instructors avoiding flying anywhere near the stall, because they could not recover such an unusual attitude. I opine that they should be able to, if they are to be instructing on type.
(I drift further, pardon me...)
During a design complince flight test in a club 172, accompanied by an instructor with rank in the club, to "check me out", he asked me to demonstrate a roll. I declined. He pressed a bit, asking, "this plane would roll wouldn't it?". Yes, but I'm not going to do it. I honestly thought it was a trap, to get me to do something stupid. From that expression of loss on his face, I realized that he really did want to experience a roll. Sad for him that he never had. It was not the time/place/airplane on that flight - his loss.
In some of the things I post here, I seek to add my one small voice to those who would say that our industry should not be diluting flight training, particularly because the training of the instructors themselves is being diluted over time. During my low hours training, I was taught spins, 'till I could do them well, I was taught flight with one engine actually feathered in the 310, until I could no longer maintain directional control, and I was taught to loop and roll. I practice these skills as often as the aircraft type permits. I hope the students of this era realize their responsibility in obtaining this type of training from compotent instructors, and gently, yet firmly, assert their right to those learning experiences.
Though the organisation and regulator can set the training curriculum and learnign goals, the student and new pilot play a role in asking for "more", and indicating that that training not being available is not good enough. That said, you lower time pilots..... You bear the responsibility for obtaining that training, taking it seriously, and having the good discipline to not fool around later!