PPRuNe Forums - View Single Post - Vortex Ring / Settling with power (Merged)
Old 7th Feb 2011, 14:09
  #339 (permalink)  
NickLappos
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: USA
Age: 75
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Crab and helisphere,
I can't subscribe to the updraft theory of VRS, it is just not that clean. The precise disk angle needed to enter and sustain VRS is not something that an armchair calculation is likely to prove. True VRS is a flaky thing, often needs the pilot to work at staying in the condition. I would be interested to chat with a long line pilot to see what he/she experienced in the event.
I would bet dollars to donuts that power issues are much more the issue, and I must say that few "experts" know much about the distinction between VRS and SWP to differentiate, including experienced and well intentioned government safety experts and investigators.
To my knowledge, no tests have shown anything close to a VRS case where updrafts and such have triggered any events. I believe the conditions that would create the updraft would also create enough turbulent flow to disrupt all those calculations (but that is a belief, not based on data.)
The situation is perpetuated with a thousand "VRS" demonstrations by a thousand instructors who show SWP to their sutdents. I searched youtube for VRS demos on video, and found NONE that were VRS, all were SWP.
To recap, to get VRS, you must descend at about 70% of the induced velocity, about 700 fpm, and also have about 8 knots forward velocity (straight down will not do). If you enter from lower descent rates, it is not VRS, it is SWP, and if you do nothing to correct the SWP, it can degrade to SWP.
None of the above means there is no danger, just explains what the physics of the situation is. The cure for either is about the same, once in the situation, but the cure to prevent SWP is to retain some power margin, enough to allow some vertical maneuvering while OGE. THAT is not mentioned in the typical VRS discussion, making it somewhat misleading to spin on and on about VRS, descent rates and updrafts, when most cases can be solved with adequate attention to power and weight.
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