Originally Posted by
RTN11
I operate from an 800m grass strip, and often PA-28s and C172s land with either 2 stages, or no flap and takeoff with no flap selected. They then end up using almost all the 800m, leaving very little reserve in the event of problems.
I always take off with 2 stages and land with 3 (PA-28), and have never had problems with the reduced climb performance, even at MTOW. I never tend to use more than 5-600m for either takeoff or landing. I do not think this would be possible flapless.
I would suggest that if the pilots are using the whole strip for landing than the problem is not the amount of flap selected but the fact that they are almost certainly landing with excessive airspeed.
With respect to takeoff, both Cessna and Piper say to use 10 deg (Cessna)
or first notch (Piper) for short field takeoffs (which IMO is appropriate for a 800m grass strip). If pilots are taking off with no flaps, or more than the recommended amount, then they are not following the procedures specified in the POH, which IMO is always a poor practice.