While in a fully developed stall the stall is maintained while the students uses boots full of rudder to intially lift the wing back to level and then they play tap dancing on the pedals keeping it that way. And only recover when prompted from the RHS.
Can anyone here tell me what happens to the pitch attitude at the point of an upright wings level stall?
Can they then please tell me what happens to the angle of attack when that happens and there is no yaw?
What are they teaching instructors these days indeed.
I have no problem with the student using rudder to maintain lateral level into and out of the stall - in fact I insist on it.
To permit them to have confidence in what the rudder can do I find that it is a good exercise as part of Ex 11 to get them to experience the rudder effectiveness throughout the stall entry and recovery and give them confidence in the fact that RUDDER ALONE will prevent yaw even at angle of atacks above the stalling angle of attack. That leads nicely to the incipient spin entry and recovery.
I am controling the ailerons and elevator and I hold full aft stick for a time to cause some stall entries and exits (note the word exit and not recovery) in quick succession. The student
prevents yaw using the rudder.
This is not an exercise in itself it is a good building block. It is not ""picking up the wing" it is "preventing yaw".
These days most of the FI population lack even the basic knowledge of stalls and have a fear of teaching the exercise and consequently students are just taught the 3 entries and recoveries that they will be asked in the test and not 1 bit more.
Ask many if they teach the stall in the climb with full power and you will be met by shock at the idea of doing something so dangerous.......so what chance is there of that FI teaching stalls and recoveries in a steep turn?
If there is a good horizon and suitable height ASFC and the aircraft is suitable then give the student the best possible training - not just the minimal pass the examination stuff.
Therefore I see MJ's comments as being typical of a situation where the person callign for the exercise to be banned does not understand the exercise and probably the fact that those from which he experienced it did not either.
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I agree 100% with BEagle when he says that schools must teach to a defined standard and must have consitent SOPs and methods. That is the only way to teach a consistent course for the general student population. Those who learn quicker will naturally have the time to experience more than one method while at the same time those that fail to understand the standard method may find an alternative method easier. But the decision to use an alternative method in order to progress must be a clear well thoughout decision with a defined objective involving the CFI and the instructor.
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of course on the other hand power controls speed and pitch altitude
Power is not one of the aircraft controls. Go back to exercise 1 please.
There is a control/controls that gives the pilot the ability to vary the power. A variation in the power will affect on the aircraft. Ask yourself what that is?
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"BEagle where I fly you have to do clearing turns for even medium and shallow turns"
A clearing turn before you do a turn! How do you know the area is clear before you start the clearing turn?
I would hope that every instructor will check for other traffic in their chosen trainnig area before starting any exercise but perhaps not and this is why we have instructors starting to demonstrate exercise 6 when one can see that in about 30 seconds they will have to turn to avoid another aircraft which is doing ex 9 nearby.
That is why I say every instructor should be automatically running through some form of HASELL prior to any exercise and consequently they are not in a position of asking the student to make a left turn andnot being sure that there is no traffic - more than abit embarasing when you ask for a turn and the student points out traffic.
Especially so when (as I hope everyone agrees) we tell the students that if we see traffic that will affect us we will always point it out and that they should always do the same i.e. I will never see traffic and wait to see if you spot it also - that is a stupid unsafe game. You see it you tell me. I see it I tell you.