S76Heavy writes:
Rules are a means to an end, not an end in themselves. I would not trust anybody who advocates strict adherence to rules just because they happen to be the rules, to operate any safety critical machinery for their obvious lack of critical thinking capability.
Absolutely correct.
And, for what it's worth, RULES are the most palatable "means to an end" known to society.
We must remember that rules are usually made AFTER something bad happens, and are rarely re-approached.
Also remember that most rules, regulations, and laws are written to constrain the lowest common denominator.
I'll mention seatbelt law in the US as an example. In most states, you can be fined as a passenger should a police officer look inside the car you're riding in and notice that you are not buckled in. This is because the cops are tired of finding heads stuck in windshields, in accidents which should have been minor and easy to "clean up" and non-nightmare-inspiring.
There are also "public drunk" laws in virtually every US town of more than 3 people. Again, the reason is simple: a great percentage of the population needs to be "corrected" a bit so they don't wander around so damn drunk they wander through plate-glass shop windows, wander underneath moving vehicles, wander into storm drains.
S76Heavy also writes
Like has been said before, I sincerely hope my kids will choose any career as long as it is not in aviation.
which is the saddest thing I've read in many a thread on this fine site.
I can understand his logic and I can't fault him for it.
But it certainly points to the fact that aviation - from the "fly my butt somewhere" perspective has become a job, rather than a love.
And that from the "my butt's going on a plane" perspective, it's just as bad. Too many have no idea of the science and discipline involved, and do not or cannot appreciate the remarkable, incredible achievement commercial air travel represents.
I was looking at some Pan Am posters the other night, those dealing with the Clippers. What a wonderful era - still exploring, still figuring out just how to go about a goal. The work put it on developing the routes, the work put in on every bloody flight.
We have, most unfortunately, devolved beyond the old Cunard slogan: "Getting there is half the fun."
We have gotten to the point where we, in fact, speak to people who aren't around us on cell phones instead of speaking to the people we are face to face with us.
It gets much worse. Go out in public sometime, and witness the number of folks who are busy making plans to be somewhere else in the nearest future, instead of actually enjoying where they are for the moment.
Motel 6... er, Hotel Tango, writes:
You're the idiot 411A. Shame on you. Even you have admited to making errors of judgement. It happens to us all. The reality is that there was never any danger whatsoever. Unfortunately in todays holy-than-thou Big Brother is watching world we live in, it was an unfortunate error of judgement. The guy does not deserve the sack. That is simply ridiculous. Too many perfect and sanctimonious posters on this thread.
First, anyone who has the temerity to call 411 an idiot or even infer he has moments of same deserves the tongue-lashing soon to follow.
Next, you can't really say there was "never any danger whatsoever" as simply having a child - or any other visitor in the tower - is slightly more distracting than not having a visitor.
But, most of the folks weighing-in seem to think that the distraction factor was very low, and not much danger was added to the mix.
I have no experience in a tower, so I don't really know what I'm talking about. But I suspect the kids provided less distraction than a windy afternoon or a mild snowstorm would have.
And, of course, you always put your ass on the fine line when you get into an airplane with running engine(s).
(Years ago, one of my father's pals used to take us on weekend flights in a Tri-Pacer 22. Tony was an excellent (if somewhat bold) pilot who NEVER let another human anywhere near his aircraft until he had thoroughly pre-flighted it, had taxied a bit (even if that was simply running it up and back around for a few hundred feet) and had had it fueled for the flight. "Most fu*k-ups happen because someone distracts the pilot when he's getting his sh*t together," was how Tony explained it.
This was around Prescott Muni in Arizona, during the early 1970s - and Tony was a master at finding places where he could nearly "hover" his 22 in thermals near mountains - it would seem you were sitting still, although you were still well above stall speed, and the illusion came from simply flying into the wind.)
I agree that it has become a ridiculous situation, and I agree that there have been a few "perfect and sanctimonious posters" herein.
Stay tuned - eventually this discussion will become mostly constructive, as the "heat" fades a bit...
Then, we'll start to see some really interesting comments.
At some point, this thread will start discussing things which went right in this event, and how those things can be constructively applied to the future.
Because this thing is destined to stay in the
BOLD / "you haven't seen it yet category" for a while as everyone weighs in, it will prolly take some time.
But don't give up hope yet...
'Specially you dads out there who have kids interested in your career and might be considering getting into aviation.
I can understand hotel's point of view, but I certainly hope that it isn't universal - because if it is, air travel will one day become truly unsafe and truly ugly.
The only thing making commercial travel palatable and safe at this point is the "culture lag" which keeps experienced FD/Cabin crew, controllers, and OPs folks in the loop.
At some point, we'll see "Air Travel v. 3.0" and at that point, we'll all be looking for bus rides.
The most disturbing thing about this thread, for me, is that we have so many non-US pilots and controllers weighing-in with opinions that clearly are against the idea of bringing children to work.
Even in this weird, hopefully never-again situation.
I hate to write this, and it will certainly get a flame or three dozen, but, frankly, we in the US tend to care for our children - and we are willing to take unbelievable steps to make sure our kids know how much we care for them.
This controller isn't anything special in this regard.
There are thousands of pilots, controllers, cabin crew, MX folks, city bus drivers, who have felt satisfaction with their careers and have taken every opportunity to pass that satisfaction on to their children.
I'm a huge fan of Greyhound in the US. I usually try to do my "lower-48" travel via the running dog. And on every trip, I've met a father or mother who had a child on the bus, simply for the reason of bringing them along and showing them what mom or dad did for a living. Regarding Greyhound, I've had my travel tickets punched by 5 or 6 year old girls who were the son or daughter of the driver.