Thanks for some great replies to the ‘army of 1’ and although they are very accurate (ta CaptPlaystation #3009 & 3015, Baron Rouge #3131, Pettifogger #3034) with some good insight into the atmosphere in the f/d that day; I feel that SFLY needs me to say it so he can adhere to some other posters’ advise? (CaptPlaystation #3002 and Tima9x #2999 !!)
Again SFLY, Boeing tried all angles of dangles and differing AoAs with differing airspeeds, on the G/S and below it, to try and get further; they couldn’t. So if it appears to you that the a/c staying on the G/S until nearing the stall was wrong, it did not detrement the distance flown at all.
I can’t find the actual post anymore (there have been a few posts deleted by the mod with regards to me!!) but someone mentioned about the lack of throttle usage on the approach. On the BA38 this was my attempt at performing a CDA (continuous descent approach) into LHR... something BA pride themselves for doing well at. On the day, it was fairly gusty below 5000’ with winds in the region of 25-35kts, so the continuous descent was a little more challenging, so as not to level fly at 3000’ over the city to intercept the glide, and of course throttling up in the process! I was pleased with my CDA, as we were spot on the glide on localiser intercept I think. However, in hindsight this was perhaps even more fortuitous, as had we throttled up and the fuel flows had increased, this could well have caused an earlier rollback; this time at 3000’ over London city! Of course being clean we would have glided much further... anyway, I’ve lived through all these scenarios ever since in my dreams, day and night! Anyway, enough of the ‘ifs’....
On the BA38 approach at approx 1200’, I was PH and at this height the throttles danced around a gust with the usual trend arrow throwing up about a 10kt surge in speed. I mentioned this to John, and said something like “that wasn’t me, it’s the a/t doing there thing”... meaning they’re reacting as usual to the gusts. Then I added, “It might be a good idea to keep the a/p in a bit longer than usual until the wind dies down across the terminal”...”Good idea” came his reply. SA shared and understood.
At about 800’ John took control and said “I have control”...”You have control”, I added.
Between the rollbacks John shared with me his problem with the throttles (splitting at this point), but then as the left engine suffered it’s rollback, the throttles married up again, so would appear normal for a while.... until at 430’ ish, we knew the required power was not being delivered.
“Pete I can’t get any power” from John, “It looks like a double eng failure” from Conor. I was looking at the eng instruments , and , yes it looks like double eng failure but isn’t. The Insts were blank but the demand line was at max. No warnings...that’s very odd, I thought.
I then elected to leave John in control... because he was a competent pilot and could carry on whilst I used the available resourses and managed the situation.
I first of all went for the continuous ignition (I’m sure I said “**** it’s a roller”... but never heard it on the CVR) but of course being RR there wasn’t one!! So I turned the switch to ‘start’ anyway seeing as my hand was there. I scanned the fuel panel to check the pumps were still on. Continuing down the panel I checked the fuel gauges ... still over 5 tonnes in each wing, pretty much balanced. Back to the throttles, again pushing them forward manually, they were firewalled. Checked the speed brake lever wasn’t out. Checked the fuel switches were running. Checked the fire handles were down.
As I was pushing down on the fire handles, “Airspeed Low” master caution....nasty sound!
And the first audible warning that was heard in the flight deck. I sternly said “Airspeed Low” in my best attention grabbing voice, looking over at John he was concentrating hard and was in control. We were on the G/S and the speed had naturally dropped back. The descent rate started to increase and was at 1800 fpm. Looking out the window, we were heading for Hatton Cross and the r/w was flying up the screen! I needed to reduce the drag, as easy as that, otherwise we were all toast. I changed the flaps.
John was in and out of the stick shaker, perfect, he was still controlling the a/c well, and I could see we might actually clear the road. Plane sorted, path sorted (as best I could) and now the people? It was 200’.... I won’t do a “brace”, the passengers are sitting happy and relaxed. Kegworth flashed through my thoughts and the amount of limb breaks produced by bad bracing of the passengers. I’ll do a Mayday to look after them... I might not be able to after we crash, who knows?
That’s roughly how it went... SFLY; but lots lots more thinking in between; but if I wrote it all, it would be quite a bit of my book ! Not that I’d be expecting you to want to read it.
None of us heard the warnings after “Airspeed Low”... the GPWS or the A/P disconnect; it was an intense period of the flight and we didn’t hear ‘useless’ warnings that we knew were non-actionable. I remember wanting to do a g/a instinctively at Airspeed low!!
I’m actually pleased the a/p stayed in until it did; it helped to get us as far as we did I think. Boeing didn’t get further from that point doing anything else. I said before, if I’d known we’d not get power back, I’d have selected lower flap sooner, at 500’ I think we’d have greased it on . I love hindsight and now knowing what a rollback is!
I believe that a pilot handling with his hands on the control column is in control, a/p in or not, as long as the a/c is doing what the pilot wants it to be doing. If it doesn’t, do something about it, using a/p or not! John was in control of the a/c and when it wasn’t doing what he felt comfortable with he did something about it. I have no problems with John’s actions that day. I had half a glance at the picture every now and again and was happy with it (you know what I mean) but would have said something to him if I hadn’t been.
Basically this is what a lot of the other posts have said this afternoon, but I’ve added some frilly bits!
Info for 'Suninmyeyes'... I can't post any links about it (cos that would be advertising) but the book's hopefully out in approx 6-8 weeks? As we are having to self publish, as no publisher wanted it, it will be sold mostly through my website (again can't 'URL' it here cos of adverts) but some of you might have found it? I'll have to buy the books upfront, and am thinking of about 500. I've got a few requests off my site, so I'm guesstimating