PPRuNe Forums - View Single Post - Continental TurboProp crash inbound for Buffalo
Old 15th May 2009, 16:55
  #1197 (permalink)  
Hot 'n' High
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
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Just been catching up with this sorry tale. Not much to add to what has been said. One thing caught my eye from DozyWannabe:-

I do wonder how strong the instinct to "pull up" is and how much training/experience is required to overcome it. Speaking for myself, I'd definitely be instinctively reluctant to push the nose down in a stall situation that close to the ground, even though logically I'd know it was the right thing to do.
Bit of a worry if that were the case here – basic airmanship at PPL levels is what we are talking about. As we all know, the most basic of training for everyone hammers home that reducing the AoA is key to recovering from a conventional stall. It also teaches that the pitch down required does not necessarily need to be that great – just sufficient to break the stall and, generally, it will not lead to too great a loss of height – not sure what a Dash 8 would lose – I’m sure some Dash 8 jock could enlighten me! Furthermore, I would assume adding power on the Dash would assist in pitching the nose down. Again, I don’t fly the Type so am resorting to basic aerodynamic theory here.

I’d definitely be reluctant not to lower the nose as what follows the other action in a conventional stall (pulling back) is just as we saw here, the aircraft eventually breaking into an incipient spin or worse. Now, that will guarantee you considerable height loss! That is why the discussion of the crew potentially “misidentifying” the upset as contaminated tailplane stall may hold some water. At least that provides a logical explanation to the actions that took place in terms of pitch. In reality, I guess we will never really know the answer to the “why” question.

When I do have time for some PPL Instructing, I do come across some trainees who, at low level, do not like to lower the nose when speed is starting to rapidly decay (ie if they start to get a bit out of shape on Final approach during early circuit training). The illustration I use to back up the Standard Stall Recovery Action, and which is applicable to them, is “I can fly at 50ft and 100 kts but I can’t fly at 100ft and 50kts”! The point is that sacrificing a little height will save the day. In this case, numbers different, concept the same – if they'd ID'd the stall correctly.

Perhaps my comfort in this sort of manoeuvre harks back to my gliding days. You get a winch cable break at 75 ft just as you are pulling hard into the 45 deg climb in a launch (and which is the most likely time for the cable to let go on you - or a kind Instructor to spring it on you!!!), you really do have to get that nose right down quick or else! You have absolutely no choice, particularly as you are already tending to hold a whole load of backpressure against the cable. But even that significant pitch down is controlled as you don't want to throw away what little height you have - it gives you time to decide exactly where you are going to land! Had to play that game more times than I care to remember!
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