Rainboe said:
"This aeroplane was not in a full stall condition, with nose drop and recovery within the low cloud base. I was practising 737 stalls in November. It is very very hard and takes tremendous stick force to hold a 737 right into a stall. You cannot maintain altitude and it takes diabolical pressure to keep the nose up. Near the stall with buffet occurring, a high ROD regime naturally occurs. The warnings, tactile, sensual and visual are manifest. You cannot do this inadvertently, not on a straight descent! Restoration of power increases speed, but pitch coupling gets the nose up again holding you in the buffet margin. I think that must have been how impact occurred. So what was the power? Idle/stopped or full thrust, 1 or 2? Totally mysterious.
"It is very very hard and takes tremendous stick force to hold a 737 right into a stall. You cannot maintain altitude and it takes diabolical pressure to keep the nose up." You have to distinguish here between the conventional nose-low one g "untrimmed into" training stall at idle power (clean or configured) and the likely scenario here....... i.e. a "pitched into" fully nose-up (back-trimmed by auto-trim) condition suddenly revealed at stick-shaker/autopilot disconnect and with the additional complication of the stall happening at max power (TOGA) and at a very nose high attitude. CHALK and CHEESE.
.
The stall happens quickly (not progressively) and the nose-drop is quite extreme - leading to the complication of a g-stall re-stall during the ground-avoidance pull-out (which is evidently what happened to the Turkish).
.
For a greater elucidation see Belgique post at
648 and Belgique earlier posts on the thread.
.
Thomsonfly unstable Bournemouth approach under investigation
By David Learmount
The UK Air Accidents Investigation Branch confirms that it is investigating an "unstable approach" by a Boeing*737-300 at Bournemouth International airport in the UK.
Unofficial sources say that incident on 23 September 2007 involved a go-around following an uncommanded power reduction that left the aircraft at stalling speed during the approach.
The crew disconnected the autopilot and autothrottle to recover the aircraft successfully to safe flight, but witnesses report that the nose-up attitude during recovery exceeded 40°*and the airspeed reduced to approximately 90kt (166km/h) at its lowest point. The crew then carried out a safe landing at the airport, the AAIB confirms.
Because the AAIB is still studying the case, which is known to have involved a Thomsonfly 737-300, it will only confirm that the event took place and that it is formally under investigation.
The airline has not responded to requests to comment. Thomsonfly is one of the airlines owned by the international TUI Travel group.
from
link