Captain Mo wrote:
Ovation, you are not required, nor should you be exactly over the top. If you have a look at the ERSA for YSBK it decribes the reporting point to be the north eastern shore of Prospect or South of the TWRN radio mast. I have flown in and out of BK for years and the people who call over, north, 5 miles out, well past the mast, or at prospect over the middle of the reservoir, well to the west, the south, anywhere but the little quarry where if you look at your VTC the arrow points to. While this may have nothing to do with this accident, It never ceases to amaze me how many students (and believe me instructors) dont know the correct reporting points. It doesnt make a difference who calls first as sequencing instructions are given once you report at 3nm/warwick farm for 11, or downwind for 29, or given earlier to avoid confusion or conflict.
I too have flown in and out of YSBK for almost 30 yrs, and agree with everything you say. On a WATLE 4 arrival I was instructed by SY RADAR to "TRACK VIA 2RN" and given traffic advisories. My point is the pilot of the twin was
NOT at 2RN when he said he was. Now had he called "INBOUND 2M S 2RN" there would be no confusion or anxiety.
Any time I fly over a VFR approach point with reporting delays due to other aircraft transmissions, I will qualify it with "APPROACHING" or "AT' or "JUST PAST", so other traffic know
exactly where I am.
My latest ERSA is in the plane, but an out-of-date one says: "ARR ACT shall TR via, and REP at one of the FLW CTR APCH points <snip> and 2RN (S of 2RN radio mast)". How far S does that mean
exactly? Does it give the distance S somewhere else?
Douche:
Pretty good for your first post - keep it up. Shot any messengers lately?
You're assuming the guy in the twin didn't understand the situation better than you. Most of them being IFR & dual COM chances are he would have had updates on your position on RADAR & be listening on BK TWR
I never assume anything. I know the difference between where he was and where he said he was was about 2 miles. BTW, Ovation was IFR with dual COM talking to SY RADAR (read above) and is as fast or faster than the twin in question.
Omndirectional wind wrote:
the reporting point is south of the mast as per the ERSA. if you were exactly overhead then the airmanship was poor on your part. The twin was south of 2RN to avoid people like you... thanks for giving us an insight into your wonderful airmanship. BK tower separating aircraft by radar, wonder why BK is a GAAP not class C
Sarcasm seems to be your strong point, and I'm guessing because you are unable to have a mature discussion. Unfortunately your post doesn't add to the debate about the safety of YSBK approach points where today, an Instructor and student both lost their life, and a very experienced pilot (ATO) was involved in the incident.
The TWR at YSBK will quickly tell you if you bust an altitude on departure, so they know who you are, where you are and where you're going - they'll even file an ESIR if they're in the wrong mood. Are you suggesting that aided with such modern tools, they should passively watch as two dots merge and one disappears, as indeed they did today?