Originally Posted by BelArgUSA
Bottom line is this. Nothing wrong about landing at say Vref+30 (or 40). That would be Vref+30 = 134+30 = 164 KIAS (I could do as much as... 175) I consider this... Hopefully dry runway, and still being stopped on 60% of the runway. Maybe even 70%, as I am not that good, I tend to flare for smooth landing. Go ahead with your objections - I am retiring and know what I say and do.
I understand your comparisons of landing weights. I also recognize that you can land on a given runway at some maximum landing weight, with whatever VREF speed that weight would require – then add the appropriate additions for winds and gusts – giving you a “maximum condition” for that particular runway. And I appreciate the fact that if you land at a landing weight less than this “maximum” landing weight, with identical wind conditions you shouldn’t have a problem in getting the airplane stopped once on the ground, even if you flew the approach at the speed that would have been required for that higher, “maximum” gross weight. But that philosophy presumes that you’re going to put the airplane on the ground at the point it should be on the ground – and very often that is not accomplished precisely because of the extra airspeed the guy driving has elected to carry. A given speed in a lighter aircraft is not the same as that same speed in a heavier aircraft. As you undoubtedly know, the handling characteristics and performance are somewhat different. It is also true that if you don’t get the airplane on the ground, it will eat up distance a lot faster by staying in the air – and a faster than required approach is much more likely to result in a circumstance where unnecessarily overflying concrete will occur. Sure, you can
plant the airplane at a speed that is a lot higher than what would have been normal, but, you have to know what to do and when to do it. (Personally, I prefer to train the pilot to be able to recognize how to do this – and the procedure I outlined for flare and landing earlier in this thread will allow you to do that.) However, if a pilot is not familiar with the handling characteristic differences presented by flying faster than what the weight requires, and does not know what to do about it when getting down to the runway, the probability goes up rather dramatically that a problem will occur.
Can a pilot do what you have outlined? Absolutely. But because not everyone is going to recognize the performance and handling characteristic differences, I would not recommend anyone doing anything differently than what they’ve been trained to do – compute the required approach speed based on the
existing landing weight; fly the approach with the appropriate wind adjustments; reach the threshold with the appropriate airspeed (that means reducing the airspeed an amount equal to the amount added for the steady-state headwind component – keeping any additive for gusts); continue to descend to the runway, flare to reach the level flight attitude with the main wheels just off the runway, take no more than 3 seconds to get the throttles to idle while you continue to descend those last couple of feet – keeping that level flight attitude constant as you descend those last couple of feet; put the mains on the runway while still in that level flight attitude; and quickly fly the nose to the surface.
Please understand … I’m not at all suggesting that you cannot, or should not, fly your airplane the way you fly your airplane. I’m just saying that the technique you’ve outlined is not something everyone should try.
Originally Posted by BelArgUSA
Maybe if the L-1011 (Delta 191) in Dallas would have done so, they might still be here. And approve.
Sorry. On this one I’m going to throw the flag. That was a microburst windshear. It is highly unlikely that even had the flight crew carried an unrealistically high approach speed, the conclusion would have been anything different than the tragedy that occurred. And I certainly don’t want to indicate to some of the younger, more eager, perhaps a bit too self-confident aviators who frequent this forum that windshear is “no big deal,” just add a big handful of knots and press on. That is a sure recipe for disaster that should not stand without a significant and very vocal challenge!