BOAC - thanks - I hope that in my writings I never, ever convey disrespect for "simple" pilots as I was one myself before a forced retirement at 60 who happens to have a passion for a particular area. Like any and all profession airman who hang around cockpits long enough, where "pilot error begins", many times I have been in less-than-ideal circumstances which, but for the interventions of crew members and others factors (pucker covers a lot of sin), could have turned out differently and I have been in circumstances where as captain when being pushed by all and sundry, a line was drawn in the sand over which I, my crew and airplane would not be crossing without a change in fuel/MEL/destination etc etc etc...it is "the way" and happens thousands of times every day without comment or visible, spectacular result. Thanks for your response - I know we, pilots through to non-airline contributors are all aiming at one seemingly elusive goal within a system which must always, in the end, pay for itself to survive.