PPRuNe Forums - View Single Post - Spanair accident at Madrid
View Single Post
Old 13th Oct 2008, 18:36
  #2164 (permalink)  
justme69
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Canary Islands, Spain
Posts: 240
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Let me clarify.

I say that thankfully there is a judiciary investigation because it will, for the next 1.5 to 2 years (according to the CIAIAC), be the ONLY source of OFFICIAL information to find out more about this case, as the CIAIAC vocal had already said that that's the amount of time they estimate to conclude their investigation and they will not publicly speak of it until then (unless, of course, they conclusively find something majorly wrong earlier and for the sake of safety they must issue a statement).

If I was i.e. a relative of a passenger/crew in that plane, I would like to have as much news as possible on what happened there, not a short preliminary report 7 weeks later and then complete silence for more than a year.

That is the part of the process I object to. Not mentioning that one must blindly trust CIAIAC members to be doing their job right.

Incidentally, if someone (say Spanair, Boeing, the ground engineer, the pilots, a passenger, a terrorist, etc) did something knowingly majorly wrong to cause the accident, and I do NOT believe that ANYBODY did in this case, why wouldn't you want to know? Why do you want the CIAIAC to end an investigation 2 years from now so that only THEN, once they (i.e.) decide that there was some sabotage by someone, a judge can open another investigation that would take so many more months etc?

(Again, I don't think that anybody is guilty of knowingly wrongdoing or criminal neglicency)

From my point of view, the "more" investigations, the better. Even the "street investigations" by the press and "couch investigations" like on web forums are, from my point of view, better than no investigations at all or only one investigation or only two investigations.

If you want to sit and wait for CIAIAC report, please by all means do so. I will wait and see for more information from the judiciary investigation, that, since it has precedence in hierarchy over the CIAIAC, has access to all the information the CIAIAC has plus additional one if the judge so demands.

We are all seeking the truth and as much information as possible so that these accidents can be prevented, right?

About the pilots, nobody doubts they were professionals with proper licenses to fly this airplane, substantial experience and additional training. The point is not to find out if they said a sentence right or wrong, but why they (potentially) failed to set the flaps/slats and verify their indicators.

If we had more information (CVR, i.e.) that showed the crew was overly distracted (i.e. like the similar LAPA case that also tried to take off without flaps and slats YouTube - Audio de la caja negra del accidente de LAPA (completo) ), then the conclusion is different than if they just "skipped over" a single item by some mistake. In the first case, the checklist system may still be "working". In the second case, something should probably be done to improve it (i.e. it has been suggested here a "killer item" quick last moment check right before take off).

And my involment in this case comes, mostly, from having a close friend that was almost killed in the similar incident to an MD-83 from MAP in Lanzarote last year. I patienly waited for the CIAIAC report and, after 15+ months of COMPLETE SILENCE, I got tired of waiting (and remember, the plane was intact, the crew was available for investigators and the company that owned the plane, MAP, carried out their own intensive investigation that concluded about a year ago and told the CIAIAC).

I didn't want the same thing to happen in this Spanair case. I wanted everybody to know, as much as possible and to the best of the available information, the likely reasons and explanations of this accident so that each could draw their own PRELIMINARY conclusions and apply their own preventive actions, until the CIAIAC reaches theirs. Without the access to all the technical information that the CIAIAC has (and doesn't share) this is, of course, very difficult. But I think we must try anyway to the best of our abilities for the sake of safety and of those demanding an explanation for the accident.

If you read this thread, you'll find out that there are many out there that want everybody to NOT disclose any information, speculations or thoughts in this thread until an official investigation report is out. I have said many times before that that's ok and they have the right to think that way and express their feelings, of course.

Some of us, on the other side, disagree that that's the best course of action, and think that it's better for everybody to continue discussing silly speculations and stupid ideas around this unfortunate accident. It's our own way of dealing with the situation. It may not be the best one and we understand that some of you feel offended by it. My apologies in advance and may I suggest you do not read this forum so that you don't become more and more offended for another year or two until the CIAIAC report concludes.

Unless, of course, you have some information you would like to share or some experience that may help others understand the accident better.

Last edited by justme69; 13th Oct 2008 at 19:55.
justme69 is offline