Owen Stanley, if a radar service is provided below 8,500 feet at Canberra when aircraft are in the “black hole” Class G, why wasn’t the Qantas crew in the serious incident (see
here) told that they were 2,400 feet below the legal altitude and about to hit Tinderry Peak? The answer is simple. No effective radar service is provided in that airspace.
For example, the pilot could be transmitting on the CTAF(R) frequency and is highly unlikely to hear a call from the radar controller to climb immediately as everyone was about to die. That is why in other leading aviation countries the system is designed to use the radar effectively.
I will say it again. In North America, including the USA, Canada and in Europe, an aircraft will remain on the air traffic control radar frequency until cancelling IFR or declaring visual. Until that point, it is the responsibility of an air traffic controller to ensure that the aircraft does not go below the legal minimum altitude.
You say:
This is why a lot of ATCs have no respect for you Dick.
You are totally wrong. There are many ATCs who email me directly and say I am 100% correct, and they could provide a proper service as professional ATCs do all around the world. They tell me that it is only a small number of older ATCs, who are totally fixed in their mind, that will not allow modern international procedures to be introduced into Australia. They tell me to keep up with what I am saying because eventually there will be a strong group of young controllers coming along with open minds, who will be prepared to support the provision of such a basic safety service.
If you can get aircraft taxiing at Canberra on your radar, you should be providing an air traffic control service to lower levels. That is what we are prepared to pay for.
If the pilot in the Qantas incident had not turned at that point, and if the EGPWS had not been working correctly, 87 people would have died and I can assure you that today we would be providing the internationally proven radar control service at Canberra for 24 hours a day.
If other modern aviation countries can use their enroute controllers to provide an approach service when the Class D and C airspace is closed, why can’t we? If it is only a matter of cost, that is what air traffic controllers should be saying. They should be saying – as some do – we would like to provide the service, it is purely the bureaucrats in Canberra being irresponsible and stopping this.
James Michael, I have said constantly I support the safety benefits of ADS-B, however our present airspace and procedures would not give those safety benefits. For example, if you had an ADS-B outlet at Canberra (or at Benalla) there would be no difference to the service that is provided at the present time. That is, the aircraft would be in good radar/ADS-B coverage right to the ground level, but air traffic control would not provide a service to prevent a pilot from a CFIT accident.
If we fix the airspace procedures, we can then use the advantages of ADS-B. If we wait until we introduce ADS-B and we have not conquered the total resistance to change regarding the procedures, we will not get the safety advantages.
I will take many years to get the fleet equipped with ADS-B – whether it is subsidised or not. Whereas to change to internationall proven procedures to provide a service which is given in every other modern aviation country in the world could be done in a far shorter time.
Keep your mind closed as much as you want to
James Michael, keep supporting the status quo and the exact Airservices/CASA/Department “don’t change anything” direction, and more people will die.
Own Stanley, by the way, I know of nowhere else in the world where airline aircraft are on two different frequencies at one time – supposedly getting some type of service from each. That is, the scenario you describe at Canberra after the tower is closed. You are saying that you are providing a service by radar, and also the pilot is providing a service on a completely different frequency.
Safe air traffic control systems are not designed this way. What we do in Australia is simply an accident waiting to happen. No doubt then, after all the people die, we will make the changes which are commonsense to most people.