Originally Posted by Rainboe
These big jets are not like gliders with instant flap in 1/2 second. The only answer in a giant jet is to hold attitude and desperately hope you will retain enough elevator control authority to stop the nose eventually dropping as the speed falls and you lose your elevators
Dear, I think I sent you enough PMs to tell you that nobody here recommended to push the nose down. But since you only listen to experienced people, I understand my words didn't reach your brain. What you are now saying is EXACTLY what I told you in my PM: holding attitude (also meaning AOA and speed). Unfortunately the crew didn't have an opportunity to understand the situation before they loose too much of speed and the consequence is that they left the AP until stick shaker...
I'm sure you are experienced enough to understand that letting the AP following the GS is exactly the contrary of what you recommend: the AP
didnt' hold the attitude but increased it up to 14 degrees nose up.
Originally Posted by Rainboe
instant flaps- they could take 20 seconds whilst sucking your elevator control dry of all power!
Once again I agree... while this is what was done... and that it contributed to increase the attitude to follow the GS (what you do not recommend as an experienced heavy jet pilot).
Originally Posted by Rainboe
That is why I am brutal with this bitching by sispanys ria. He thinks he is an expert because he taught engine out in a little single engine fighter with no control problems.
Sadly your 18 years experience didn't taught you how to hold control over your words. You should read dxzh's post, you would learn a lot on how to share a different point of view.
Originally Posted by Rainboe
Stick the nose down, and it may be the last thing you ever do.
This is exactly what the FO did at 170 ft... Please note that this nose down input is the consequence of letting the AP increase the attitude till stall...
Basically they did
all the contrary of what you recommend (as an experienced heavy jet professional) :
They didn't hold the attitude
They did retract the flaps
They made a nose down input at low speed/altitude
As dxzh said very nicely, it's too bad that the newspaper needs to decide wether the crew made it right or wrong. In most cases, the truth is in between and we (as experienced professional) should be able to understand it clearly. It is absolutely not a matter of judging the crew, since they obviously are not the cause of the accident. Still, their actions could be analyzed for the sake of safety in finding how their actions could have been improved. According to Rainboe's attitude, I guess there wasn't so much of CRM during his 18 years of heavy 747 operations...