PPRuNe Forums - View Single Post - RAF buys spy planes to monitor enemies from the sky
Old 28th Aug 2008, 15:28
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Backwards PLT
 
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Cirrus F - You obviously have close links to the manufacturer as well as absolutely no idea about military aircraft operations, particularly ISTAR. Flying in Afghanistan is not like a flying club in the UK.

Lets start with some basics - the glossy brochure and website are very pretty but very vague and have some dubious claims. Alarm bells ringing (I've read lots of similar BAE brochures). What actually is the endurance with the UK operational fit, including payload/sensors, DAS etc, operating from Kandahar with an acceptable fuel reserve. I assume it does have DAS because flying around at 10,000'-15000' AMSL in Afghanistan is a very bad idea without one. I assume it can fit the extended range tanks as well as the full mission kit/crew, whilst giving satisfactory performance. How noisy is it? Twin props not good for this.

Manufacturer quoted running costs are a world away from real UK MOD running costs, even if the MOD started a flying club in Middle Wallop. Add lots more if you are in Afghanistan, with some avionics involved, so be careful with the Islander comparisons.

Intrigued by the sat link - as there is no room for a dish (unless you removed the crew) it must be very limited, certainly not FMV. Also, if it isn't sensitive where does the EO/IR system come from?

There must be some limitation with using UAVs for ISR tasks (perhaps someone who knows a bit more will explain why), hence why the UK is shifting to a manned platform like the DA42 as well as continued use of Reapers, etc
I think the real answer is that commanders want ISR now (or at least in the next 12 months) and don't care where it comes from. So anyone who pushes a "cheap" and instant solution gets a contract - UAV manufacturers are already working flat out. I think manned aircraft will be doing ISTAR for a good while yet.

if the operator is himself a soldier, maybe even from the same unit as the ground-patrol, then you're going to have a more flexible and more closely integrated unit
I don't think that anyone would suggest taking a squaddie from a ground unit and putting him in this role for a few months (or do you mean for that day?) whilst his regiment are on the ground. You need specifically trained personnel, if you want them to be any good. Or do you want to take 10 guys from every regiment in the country and train them and keep them trained? Secondly it would produce a very inflexible system, with personnel focused solely on their unit. Of course if the aircraft is only a company level asset then it might be ok (see desert hawk) - but it then becomes an extremely expensive and inflexible piece of kit for the JFC. How about an aircraft operated by people from all services so that each can apply their expertise to the situation where required? What a weird idea, it'll never catch on.

And I think the 1930s view of RAF Aircrew that some have pushed are actually pretty hilarious. Grow up, or better, go talk to the Harrier guys and tell them your views to their face if you ever visit Afghanistan.
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