PPRuNe Forums - View Single Post - Close air support at its finest, from the squaddie's perspective
Old 6th Jan 2008, 23:25
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Magic Mushroom
 
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From my safety in Blighty the fighting in Afghanistan seems relativley low tech from the enemies point, are we not, with talk of putting guns on £80 million super high tech fighters and directing them against low tech tribeman, going about things the right way?
Are there aircraft in the world we could buy and re-equip. Reasonably in- expensively?
Nostrinian,
A valid question which is being asked elsewhere. Firstly, don't be suckered into thinking terry Taliban and his mates don't have access to some pretty decent threat systems. That's why we have to spend a fair bit of cash equipping our helos and mulit engined assets with advanced defensive aids systems (DAS).

Looking specifically at procuring a low cost CAS asset along the lines of a PC-21 or Super Tucano, there is undoubtedly some role for these assets in an Afghan type scenario. Their main limitation is their ability to persist around the battlespace and be retasked quickly.

Having flown in a C2 role over both Afghanistan and Iraq, it was and remains common for assets to be dynamically retasked. For instance, a USAF F-15E may be retasked from providing convoy route overwatch for NATO forces in Northern Afghanistan to providing CAS to UK ground forces in Helmand. Fast jets (even GR9s!) can get there quickly and have the ability to go and tank to maintain persistance.

A PC-21 type would take a lot longer (this is even a problem with the A-10 which would sometimes be overlooked for retasking simply because we knew it wouldn't get to an incident in time), and would be unable to tank. Yes you could fit AAR probes to a wing location but then you'd have to buy some C-130 type tankers which adds to the cost of procurement. It could be argued that the cheaper cost of a PC-21 allows persistence to be obtained by procuring more aircraft. However, to do this you'd need to stick turbo-prop CAS all over the place which is a very uneconomical way to use Air Power (and personnel). Deploy them to FOBs and hold them on GCAS? Trouble is you then immediately increase massively the force protection elements deployed out in the field and create numerous 'tethered goat' targets for the enemy!

Turbo-props also lack the sheer psychological impact of a fast and low 'show of force' which will often avoid the actual employment of weapons, and lack the sensors and payload of most fast jets. The sensor issue is another rarely acknowledged limitation of the A-10 which is a very good clear weather asset but severely limited when the weather clamps in.

In summary, cheap turbo-prop CAS would have some use in a modern COIN campaign, especially in an AFAC or SCAR type role. However, their slow speed and limited payload/sensors in particular limit their value in comparison to a combination of fast air, armed UAVs and AH.

If we were going to spend the cash on anything, a few AC-130s would be of more use. However, they'd be hugely expensive to operate unless we could get some sort of Ro-Ro 'Spooky-lite' capability for our Js.

(still haven't worked out why you can't take the crews out of modern aircraft such as Typhoon and Apache and replace them with 250 kgs of comms and IT gear)
Cyclone,

Because you'd need a lot more than that to even come close to what a soft pink body or 2 can achieve. The technology is just not mature enough yet.

Have you never served before?
LM,

Please don't ever stop posting your comments on this board!! I know you're busy at the 'tip of the (combat flight sim) spear' seeing things that 'we can only dream of' but you brighten my day considerably with your descriptions of RoE application and kinematography etc!!!! Priceless!!!

Regards,
MM

Last edited by Magic Mushroom; 7th Jan 2008 at 22:03.
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