Don't want to perpetuate the thread drift but: Oligoe, I happen to fully agree with your post reference individuals abilities. I have also had the privelige of working with many different nationalities. However what seperates Aircraft Engineers from "car mechanics" I now some excellent ones and "tractor mechanics" nope dont know any of those, is that piece of paper attesting to a level of knowledge attained. When that is undermined and devalued so are we all!!