It seems to me there is not only an 'us and them' relationship between pax and RAF AT, which is understandable, though it needs tackling at all times, but also between parts of RAF AT which is just not acceptable! This division is not unique to the RAF, or even to the military. It exists in the airlines as well, and is a constant source of irritation to fare paying (in this case) pax. The person most able to ameliorate it is the aircraft captain concerned. The reason why ground staff say nothing, or use phrases like "operational reasons", or simply lie (and has been said blaming ATC as often as not), is that they know nothing themselves. The "loop" is designed to keep the show on the road, involving OPS, Crews and ENGs, in real time and rarely has the time or inclination to issue a running commentary to ground staff/ movers. So if you are a captain involved in such a delay situation, you are in a privileged position, possibly the one person with the clearest overall idea about what the hell is going on. Share it! When you have sent and received the necessary flurry of signals, phone or HF calls, brief the crew, engs etc, then go and talk to the DAMO and or his staff, and agree what to tell/ do with the pax. Offer to have a word with them yourself. I seem to be teaching my Granny to suck eggs, but some of the posts on this thread are very worrying. Aircrew that call Movers Tossers, or vice versa for that matter, are saying more about themselves and their own attitudes than about others. You are all part of RAF plc, and your customers are not impressed by you calling one another names and ignoring them!
Last edited by Chugalug2; 21st Oct 2006 at 11:59.