Originally Posted by wheresthecoffee
FCOM 1.22.40 Flight Envelope
quote verbatim:
The maneuvering speeds :
* Green Dot Speed
* S speed
* F speed
unquote
When you take off with config 1, you don't have the same flap/slat configuration as you do when you select flap 1 on approach - maybe there lies the difference!
Thanks for the quote and I stand corrected. Hovever, I still stand by my original post in that you can retract to clean at S speed (which is defined as 1.23 Vstall clean) so the 1+F/1 debate isn't really relevant. VLS clean is the same as S speed.
I spent many years on the A320 from when it first came into service and did a manufacturers course all those years ago. We were definitely taught that coming back to VLS is OK. I think that, over the years, the original Airbus concept of flying anywhere between VLS and VMAX in whatever config you happen to be in has been diluted by successive generations of ex-Boeing pilots who have got used to doing it the other way. I must say that converting onto my current Boeing, I found it hard to understand why you couldn't come back to min manoeuvring speed (which, I would imagine, is the minimum speed you can manoeuvre at). As I said above, my Boeing manual says you have full manoeuve capability at 20kt below the manoeuvre speed.
What I am sure about is it is perfectly OK to go a few kt below S speed while at F1, unlike on my Boeing which does not allow it.