Cyclic Rick,. .. .1) We have used Settling with Power as another term for Vortex Ring State. For clarification, this is the flight regime where the rotor descends into its own downwash, recirculation forms that robs the rotor of thrust, and the power to produce flight thrust becomes very high. Without sufficuent power, the aircraft descends and "settles with power" even when the pilot raises the collective and increases the power a bunch. . .. .The exact rate of descent where it occurs is based on the disk loading (weight per square unit of rotor area) of your machine. The higher the disk loading, the greater the downwash speed and the higher the rate of descent that you must achieve to enter VRS.. .. .2) IMHO,the lesson of Black Hawk down is a complex one, but is mostly that A) Day missions with night tactics don't work, B) You cannot enter an armed hostile crowd without being willing and able to kill them all C) Honor and valor in combat are as often sparked by the futility of the mission and D) Like many military endevors, the mistakes of that mission are not necessarily the mistakes of those who had to fly it. I knew Ray Frank, (Durant's co-pilot), he was a friend, and a finer aviator and soldier has never graced pprune.. . . . <small>[ 26 March 2002, 10:13: Message edited by: Nick Lappos ]</small>