Please do tell how to become a BA or Virgin Captain in less than 20 years.
I must admit I read the original sentence in another way and possibly incorrectly thought he meant 'PILOT' with BA or Virgin, not specifically captain with same..........
However, I understand that current time to command in BA is around 15 years (not sure about Virgin Atlantic), so perhaps the comment still stands. However, I personally believe that the BA retirement age will go up to 60 within the next 15 years, therefore 20 years to command would be a realistic time to assume for new joiners, but over such a long period things will surely change.
As I said though, I was playing Devil's Advocate to Cruise's post. I was merely trying to point out that not all airlines are the same, even those that you can get into with 200hrs. I personally would recommend Wannabes to look at what is obtainable in their future careers with the various carriers, which will help them to make better career decisions once they get a start (with anyone!) First job has to be whatever you can get, but I have always advocated getting the experience required as quickly as possible and moving to your 'employer of choice' just as soon as you can.
Also, not all Wannabes are in the same financial position once they qualify, so I stand by those comments too. The fact that my airline pays ONE captain £147k does not mean it is the norm, as I pointed out. I also gave the top salary scale, which is very achievable for anyone joining the airline, as are the starting scales for commanders. I will also say again that I fly for a charter airline, which has fallen behind it's major competitors with regard to basic salary over the last few years. All these companies employ 200hr Wannabes in some shape or form (be it sponsored, direct entry or through a scheme like CTC), so I think the example is entirely relevant.
I do however agree that these are not the
majority of jobs that low hours guys are going to get first off (the lucky, dedicated, determined individuals may well though) and the other end of the spectrum is flying a small turbo-prop for a small outfit that knows all its F/Os leave within a year or two so therefore don't pay much above minimum wage!
Sure, you can expect disrupted rosters, night stops and minimum rest, along with bad terms and conditions possibly when you first start, but you should view a job like that as just another stage of your 'training'...........
More and more of the 'better' employers have things like block window protection for their pilots. These have usually been well negotiated by your CC reps. Many others aspire to such practices and are pushing for similar schemes in their airlines. It is a subject in itself, but roster disruption usually occurs due to bad rosting practices; if you can stamp those out your don't get a 'firefighting' method of rostering on a daily basis, where the company likes to have the power to change anybody they wish onto any duty these wish. I have worked for two airlines that are completely diametrically opposed when it comes to rostering. They are both charter airlines, doing the same thing, on a similar scale. One was a rostering nightmare, the other is almost 100% stable. Bad rostering costs companies serious amounts of money as well as screwing your life and body clock up. Demonstrate how it can be improved and show the 'win, win' for the pilots and the company and an 'enlightened' management can not ignore the argument (just show the accountants the millions that can be saved in a year!) So there are good and bad out there and Wannabes could end up working for either. I do however agree that the majority of employers are still in the dark ages with respect to this.
As for my comments about not moving house, well perhaps that needs a little further clarification. Obviously for your first job at said 'minimum wage T/P outfit' will probably necessitate your moving to Timbuktoo (sp?) and living on a pittance for the bond period (ish). What I meant was once you join an airline that you like that can fulfil your career aspirations be very careful about selling everything up and moving 'for them', as it is just like employment and redundancy; you are a commodity and business decisions are made for the sake of the business, not for the sake of keeping your loyalty rewarded. I would suggest living where you want to live (be that on the doorstep of your prefered base or not) and if you need to change bases look very carefully at the future and work out all your options before moving to that 'new' base with one aircraft that could easily close again in a year's time if they have got their sums wrong.
Weekends are weekends. Tuesdays and Wednesdays are quite often a pilot's weekend. If you join this industry without an understanding of that then you really are away with the fairies. That doesn't make it any easier for my wife who stands on the edge of a wind and rainswept playing field on a Saturday morning to watch No.1 son's game of football, with sons No's 2 & 3 getting cold wet and miserable (as is she) whilst I soar overhead with a hot cup of tea and 6 lovely ladies asking which lunch I would like...............
That's reality and there is no getting away from that, but I can achieve plenty on my days off during the week and actually enjoy being around when most 'normal' people are at their desks, including having several jars at the local with a bunch of similar minded individuals (yeah, usually pilots!) I do agree that the lifestyle is disruptive and prevents you from doing many of the things that our friends take for granted........but if you want that, go get a 9-5.
So to summarise, I am only playing Devil's Advocate and putting the other side. It is not all doom and gloom. 2005 is going to be a bumper year for recruitment (according to our MD who predicted 800 new positions at a recent presentation to Balpa delegates) and many of the chaps who a year or so back were enjoying their first job will now be in a position to push to get a 'better' lifestyle with a n other employer.
I recommend chatting to all pilots currently employed if you want to get the picture of what your future holds. You will hear good, bad and indifferent opinions. It's down to you to decide which are valid for you are where you want to end up. I personally still think you could get a command in Virgin Atlantic in 20 years if that's what you want. Do remember that situations change. My employer had a time to command of 15 years only last summer. It is now down to about 6-7 for new joiners and for those who already have a little experience you can apply to move across to our new lo-cost airline after virtually no time at all. A number are doing just this. Right place, right time.
Best of luck to you all.
PP