Thats all fine, but when someone pitches up on the instr. forum with a question like that its OK. but state who he /she is I am so VERY SORRY. BUT, I just thought an instr would know the answer to that one, and it concerned me that that chap did not. ANYWAY I have nearly had enough of the misunderstandings and jumping on people arround here its getting to much like a real flying club. bye