Slanderous Smith Comments

[Shitsu-Tonka]

Transcript from Radio 4BC

JOHN MILLER: Well, a media release out this morning from the redoubtable Mr Dick Smith, who would probably be one of the best known and much admired Australians.
And in part of this media release he says, of course... it's about the new air traffic control arrangements, or air space arrangements, I should say, for Australia, which have been the subject of much controversy in recent times.
In part of the release Dick says, of course, I don't expect the media to use this press release as there's an unwritten rule that you only write stories like close call points to air safety time bomb and we're all going to die.
Well, here we are, Dick, good morning.
DICK SMITH: Hello Ross. How are you?
ROSS DAVIE: Good thank you, Dick. How are you doing?
SMITH: Wonderful, really fantastic. No, the main thing is the media release is good news, and I'm delighted you're talking to me, that despite the beat ups, by especially the Air Traffic Controllers Association.
In fact, there's just... the latest figures show there's been a 21 per cent reduction in these near misses since we've brought in the new air space. And this was exactly as planned by John Anderson, the minister. The air space, it's safer than ever to fly, so have a lot of confidence if you're flying.
MILLER: Dick, you were a foundation member of the Aviation Reform Group, which was set up by John Anderson to oversee the implementation of this United States style air space system in Australia.
SMITH: That's right.
MILLER: Did that group include any professional pilots and professional air traffic controllers?
SMITH: Well, by crikey, it certainly... the most professional person there was Angus Houston, who is the head of the Air Force, who's flown, of course, jets, flown extensively in the United States. So you couldn't have anyone better than that. But...
MILLER: But did it include any... sorry to interrupt, Dick, but did it include any currently serving commercial or general aviation professional pilots or currently serving professional air traffic controllers?
SMITH: No, no, it didn't, because the minute you do that, what they insist on is you basically go back to the 1950s.
See the problem is that especially the professional air traffic controllers, they are specifically trained to follow rules and not to ever change rules. And so they just constantly run a campaign, they want to talk about this, very important, to stop any change to the future, any move forward.
Now you had a serious incident in Brisbane last week where a Virgin plane was allowed to descend to within 400 feet, it's claimed, by the air traffic controllers, of another plane. Now, I can tell you now, that is the most terrible thing I've ever heard. Anywhere else in the world, the air traffic controller would have said to the Virgin plane, stop your descent at 16,000 feet or whatever it is, I have a small plane below you.
MILLER: Sure.
SMITH: What the air traffic... you're saying, sure. The air traffic controller allowed the Virgin plane to descend right into the smaller plane. By the way, both planes were on radar, both planes were talking to air traffic control. The air traffic controller allowed this to happen. It's basically criminal.
They did the same thing in Melbourne a few weeks ago where they turned a small plane, under radar control, under the Virgin plane, and then let the Virgin plane descend right on the top of it again.
MILLER: Okay Dick, that wasn't a dismissive sure, I was agreeing with you. Incidents like that are deplorable, but accidents will happen, nobody... given that human nature is not perfect.
However, let's get back to this issue of not having professional air traffic controllers and professional commercial pilots on these... on this committee, or whatever.
SMITH: Yep.
MILLER: I mean surely if you're going to design a bus, you talk to the bus driver, don't you?
SMITH: Yes, the problem is that the professional air traffic controllers naturally have a self interest in making sure there's as many air traffic controllers employed as possible. So what's happened, for thirteen years, when the government's tried to move forward to a modern air space system... And by the way, this one is not just the US system, it's the system used in Canada, used in Europe, it's simply the most efficient in the world.
What's happened over the years, the air traffic controllers have run a very effective industrial campaign to stop any move forward to a more efficient system. We've now got that system, and they're running a campaign to destroy it.
Because, can you imagine, Qantas does about 70 per cent of the flying, but they've had none of these near miss records. Now Qantas flies constantly in the United States. More to the point Virgin Atlantic, the sister airline owned by Richard Branson as well, flies dozens and dozens of flights in the United States through this class Echo air space that we have in Brisbane. They never have a problem. But we've had three. And the one last week was so horrific I cannot believe it.
But what's worse, the pilot, who's a 25,000 hour pilot of the small plane, who was flying from Maroochy to St George, and nearly had this plane run into him, he was told by the Air Traffic Safe... the Air Transport Safety Board that, oh, he should have called up the Virgin plane and start talking to it. Now that's the 1950s system. We now have radar, and air traffic control is supposed to not descend one plane into another.
MILLER: Look, I haven't spoken - and I know a few - I have not spoken to one professional jet jockey, and these are guys included who are trainers, and trainers on big aeroplanes like 767s and 747s, I've not spoken to one of them who's had a kind word to say about this system.
SMITH: Yes, that's right, because you know what they're saying...
MILLER: This is the pilots, not the controllers.
SMITH: ...Yeah, I'll explain to you. What they're saying is, we won't... we don't want small planes in commercial air space. Now, there's no such thing as commercial air space. That would be like the bus drivers saying, look, we don't want private cars on our roads. Now that would be...
MILLER: Yeah, but the private cars aren't doing 600 mile an hour.
SMITH: No, but what's been shown throughout the world, and throughout Australia, small planes and large planes can mix perfectly safely, as long as you have the right rules. At the moment Qantas have sixteen jet movements a day into Ayers Rock, it's in class G air space, the lowest safety level, and it works perfectly safely.
Above Brisbane we have class Echo air space, which is the same as... above Los Angeles, above JFK Airport, where Qantas fly everyday, works in perfect safety in the United States.
But the pilots are saying here, oh no, it can't work in Australia, cannot work here, and then for this extraordinary reason we're getting these planes that are so close that the collision avoidance system goes off.
Now I've read each of these reports, and if you use commonsense, the air traffic controller would not allow one plane to descend into the other.
In the particular case of the one in Brisbane, the Virgin plane has it on its special little screen, because all of these small planes have to have a special black box transponder, but the Virgin pilot kept descending, so he got to within 400 feet of the small plane. Now we've got to find out why.
DAVIE: So Dick, can I summarise, and unless I've got the bull by the tail here, you're saying that the air traffic controllers are deliberately, if you like, manipulating the system to justify their own existence?
SMITH: That's all I can work out, because what could any other explanation be? Why would you let... let me explain this to you. There was a Virgin plane coming in from the Townsville to Brisbane. There was a small plane going from Maroochydore to St George. So they were going to cross. Both were talking to air traffic control.
The air traffic controller kept saying to the Virgin plane, I've got a small plane crossing, I've got a small plane crossing, have you sighted it? Trying to say that he had to see it. Whereas in the international system - and anyone listening will say this is commonsense - all he had to do was limit the descent of the Virgin plane until the small plane had passed.
That what happens everyday. I've sat in the Qantas flight deck going into LA, that's exactly what they do, it works in perfect safety. Here they are stirring this up and risking people's lives for an industrial agenda.
MILLER: Dick, what do you say to assertions then that this has all been left in the hands of, in your case, a gifted amateur?
SMITH: Well, that's what's said all the time, but let me explain this, that what the government decided after thirteen years of not moving ahead to this safer air space system, they said, look, we want to set up a group.
I was just one member of it. As I explained to you, had the top of the Air Force, because he's flown in the United States, he's a commercial pilot of the ultimate experience. And what we did was we were given the job to look around and say, what's the best air space system for Australia?
And we looked around, and the American system, because of the enormous amount of wealth that country has, and because of the fact that everyone sues everyone else, it's evolved into the safest air space system in the world. It's basically like a 747. It's incredibly safe.
Now ten years ago, I bought [sic] in rules, which the pilots were against, that allowed standard Boeing 747s to operate here without being modified. In other words, we could have a standard 747, which you're now flying with Qantas, that can operate here without being modified. That's what we're trying to do with the air space.
But, I've just one very important point to make, John and Ross, and that is that what the air traffic control company has done, we, and in this aviation reform group, believed that they would get some American experts out here when they introduced the air space.
They have refused, they have undermined the minister in every way, and they've said to him, oh look, we wrote to the Federal Aviation Authority three months ago, but they never answered us.
So you've got an American air space system coming in here, but no American government experts standing in the towers, behind the radar screens, monitoring that we're doing what they do in America. And I can tell you, we're not doing that because the Air Traffic Control Association is running a campaign to stop this from working because they know it's more efficient.
MILLER: Okay Dick, good to talk to you this morning, thank you.
SMITH: Thank you.
MILLER: And we'll be seeking some response from the Air Traffic Controllers Association of that little lot.
DAVIE: Rather alarming claims there.


Media Release from CivilAir