Originally Posted by
Jonty
I disagree with both those points.
First the 10 min TOGA limit. 3 issues with this really. First, is it 10 mins total? Is 10 mins continuous? If I use 8 mins during the first go around do I only have 2 mins left? Second, it's actually an EGT limit that's been converted to a time limit because us pilots are too stupid to look at the EGT gauge. If I climb to altitude TOGA, MCT, and Climb Thrust are all the same. Does my 10 min limit count now? Thirdly, and this is the most important, if I need it I'm going to use it. 10 min limit or no 10 min limit. However, it's in the manual that it's a 10 min limit, and so it should be respected where possible. But people need a deeper understanding of why the limit is there and what it's secondly trying to achieve, rather than 10 mins and that's it.
The next point I also disagree with. On an SE missed approach you can follow the EOSID, or the EFATO procedure, or the normal missed approach, or even the normal SID, or any combination of the above. YOU are the captain of your aircraft, its safety is YOUR responsibility, not the manuals, not ATCs, not managements, YOURS.
Originally Posted by
Jonty
You have made my point quite well. Its not a hard limit in that if you exceed it not much will instantly happen. It is however a limit. Like the MLM, or VNE, or all the other limits we have on aircraft.
Use it for 10 mins, but don’t crash into a hill because your 10 mins are up.
And here’s a thought with regards to the 10 min limit. If I use 10 mins for TOGA, what has to happen before I can use another 10 mins?
Having a deeper understanding of your aircraft is not a dangerous thing, it worries me that you think it would be. It stops you thinking you know better, but it also allows you to understand what the actual limits are and why they are there. If you do have a better understanding of your aircraft you are less likely to start arbitrarily disregarding set procedures, but you are more likely to chose the right procedure for your situation. You’re also far more likely to understand the outcome of any given procedure and its overall effect on your aircraft before you commence the procedure and therefore make decisions in a timely manner.
Do you notice all the nonsense you're talking? Like for real, aren't you worried about it? "OH THE 10 MIN TOGA IS NOT ACTUALL 10 MIN, WHAT IF WHAT IF..." 10min and then MCT, it's not about agreeing or not, IT IS LAW. You dont do the 10 min? Good, prepare your ass, if everything goes good you'd better have a very good explanation, if something goes SLIGHTLY wrong... Say goodbye to your license, job and maybe life ( jail time, remember not following procedures and the result is someone being injured could cost your free will ).
Also, you have a very nice app which calculates gradients for the go around/sid etc and if not, you'll most likely have several thousands of sheets on your ipad saying which gradient you'll have on an EFATO/EOSID/EOGA or EVEN your airline has a very VERY NICE study in which all or most part of the airports you fly to, with their procedures are withing the envelope of the aircraft. Might have to check again those ATPL subjects or some ICAO documents.
I cant believe you go flying not knowing that you aircraft complies with the gradients not to mention that you guys believe that the airline does that and you just follow blindly. That goes for maverick as well, the initial pilot warrior that started the post.