Originally Posted by
Genghis the Engineer
4th, behind (in order) the USA, China, France. Which is not to say that the UK aerospace industry isn't still huge and capable - although the ability to build, test and certify large aircraft has eluded it for some years. There are increasing efforts to rebuild that capability, and they may get somewhere - but not quickly.
UK can do engines, wings, gear, and still has and trains some exceptional flight testers. The overall large aircraft airframe integration capability is sadly not here any more, and we'd be deluding ourselves to claim otherwise. We should also throw ourselves behind efforts to rebuild that.
On the VC10 - lovely fast, comfortable, nice handling airframe. Also very inefficient low bypass engines located poorly for maintenance, heavy, and systems that should stay firmly in the 1960s where they belong. If you were to build a new one, it would probably look more like a C1(K) than anything BOAC ever operated, but would still be a lot less good for that job than an A330MRTT in terms of just about anything but handling. (Just ask some Airbus Flight Test Engineers about the fun they had creating FBW refuelling laws!).
IF the UK is to get back into part 25 manufacture again, and I would love to see that happening, we should be looking iteratively to first build a modern business jet or turboprop, and it should be just that - MODERN. If it happened to look like a Jetstream or HS125 that should be totally co-incidental. From there, the revitalised capability should then be looking to something that beats late model A320s and B737s on economy and environmental efficiency. That means technology several generations beyond a VC10: latest avionics, 3D printed components, lots of (recyclable) composites, ultra reliable engines and systems giving global ETOPS, massive payload fraction. And if we do, I really hope to be working on it.
G
Genghis,
You may well be right. Even though the ADS, or SBAC as it used to be, is still trumpeting the UK as the 2nd, being behind China does sound sensible, so I will settle on an equal 3rd bumping along with France!
The case for large aircraft integration is less sound though, I happen to know personally a few of the Airbus types doing this in Toulouse and Hamburg, and they are Brits, as are a fair few of their colleagues.
Don't forget that Bombardier, or Spirit Aero as it is about to become, still does a large amount of part and whole fuselage work, and the fact that there is not a lot of high tech involved in airliner assembly. British Aerospace, as was, were offered final assembly for, at differing times, the Boeing 757 and the Airbus A320, and on both occasions turned it down as there was no real value add and not a whole lot of jobs. The real work is done out at the component factories where sections are as near as possible complete before being sent to Toulouse or Hamburg. Not many places DO do large aircraft assembly now though do they? Not sure that regaining it would add that very much. And who would do it? Certainly not BAE systems. I am aware of a few high tech start ups, and wish them success, but breaking that Airbus/Boeing strangle hold is going to be really difficult, as the Chinese, Russians and Japanese have found out.