Quite right Scan+3,. .. .That is why I specified the 737-2/3/4/5. (Don't know about 7 & 8) The scarebus I now drive is different again. I would presume that any MD type would not suffer from the 'ground effect' I previously mentioned. . .. .By the way I'm not claiming any expert knowledge here, I've just been applying what I've been taught many moons ago.. .. .One other point, I would think that performance is worked out on the assumption that the A/C is rotated smoothly at the correct rate through to the correct pitch attitude. . .. .Regards. .Exeng