Originally Posted by
Sam Ting Wong
I
The industry at a whole is in a constant downward trend and there is no escape.
I disagree with Slasher that those who are willing to accept a deal are selfish, nor would I criticise anyone for acting in self-interest. It's just rational behaviour. We all are acting the way we expect to gain the most, but simply have either a different base line, different expectations or different risk scenarios. Voting no does not make you a better person.
I totally respect your positions, maybe it will work in the end, who knows. I just think it is not worth the risk. All I am asking for is to respect other viewpoints as well and please let's keep the discussion civilized and rational.
What part of "we all screw each other and then wonder a decade later how we got to the bottom" is rational ? Not in my world. And in my opinion it's the perfect definition OF selfish--one acts in a self centered matter which knowingly undermines and damages the collective organization and ultimately results in the denigration of the individuals' situation as well (kinda poetic justice in a way). Now, if your plan is collect and bail I guess one can rationalize such actions to oneself, but at some point in your life I think you're going to look back on the decision as one of your darker hours (kinda like someone who crosses a picket line). Now, it IS most definitely a failure of the HKAOA to act as a collective body (and maybe have the wherewithal to strike if necessary--although from the TA the CC/TB actually apparently IS really causing distress as is the mass exodus. Right off the starting block as a precondition; another rule of negotiation violated in that you do not set conditionals outside of a complete TA. Very high priority for the company apparently). So if the fact of the matter is that if there cannot be a union formed which CAN act effectively as a group (and NOT allow factions to be played off against each other as has been done) I guess that makes ones' selfish decision more rationalizable (at least to oneself) -- but it still leaves destruction in its wake and a person has to live with this.
I do not share your hobbesian view of the industry at present; perhaps that's because I (and several colleagues) are bombarded with entities looking for pilots. The raw numbers might not be as high (at least for the first couple of years compared with a gheezer on one of our older contracts), but the COL is way lower and the conditions better (and even dare I say it -- fun ?). If you set the standard at the bottom and "at least I'm not getting shot at as much here on the street" then, yes -- perhaps there are some who would prefer living in a cracker box taking on huge debt and barely scraping by with family life falling apart to getting knifed on the street. Maybe THAT'LL sell POS18 -- "Hey--we're better than the slums of Venezuela." But I don't think even this is working out so well for them (hence the decision to upgrade SOs and dangle the false carrot of basings for those dumb or desperate enough to actually want to believe in it). It IS disheartening that rather than striving for greatness we are comparing things to the absolute bottom of the barrel. I don't think this has ever worked out very well.
I can think of no more toxic environment than when peers are divided amongst each other.
In any case good luck. Old Ben had it right when he said hang together or hang separately. What does baffle me is how a union would allow something to be advanced which DOES divide the membership; cutting its throat as well as its members. I would hope those advancing the agenda do realize they have a responsibility toward the membership and toward stopping the decline (which is opposite most of the developed world) -- and not just toward different factions within the membership. None of us here are smart enough to play the manipulation game (nor is this a good game to play).