Originally Posted by
Dick Smith
I wonder if those of you posting on this site who want to keep our incredibly complex frequency boundaries on the chart actually fly in the system very often. Can I suggest you use your Ozrunways, Avplan, or even just a VFR chart, and put in a typical route I fly.
That is – Terrey Hills (YTRY), Hornsby (HSY), overhead The Oaks (THK), overhead Goulburn (YGLB), to Gundaroo (YGDO). Let’s do the trip VFR, let’s say at a minimum of 1,500 feet AGL enroute and remaining OCTA.
Let’s look at the complexity of the flight.
Initially on departure I would be monitoring SY CEN 125.8 (Woronora). Half way down the lane of entry I change to SY CEN 124.55 (Kings Tableland). Then 45 miles DME Sydney, change to ML CEN 129.8 (Mt McAlister). About 10 minutes later, change to another Mt McAlister ML CEN frequency 121.2, but that is only for about 5 minutes, then change to MEL CEN 124.1 (Mt Ginini) coming into Goulburn. About ten miles later, there is another change to CB APP 124.5 (Mt Majura).
That is a total of six changes – not including the aerodrome frequencies.
Now I have been doing this, as mentioned, for over 20 years. Once you get away from Sydney Centre you hear all this traffic – I think it is high flying airline aircraft. I have no idea where they are, because they don’t give position reports.
On an equivalent flight in the USA you would just leave your second radio on 121.5 – an ideal position to give a MAYDAY and if ATC wanted to contact you, they would get a high flying airline to call you at your location on the guard frequency.
I have just described a typical flight here, that takes about 50 minutes in the Agusta A109. There are many other flights that are far more complex than this one.
Why would you make it so ridiculously complex when other aircraft are not giving position reports? Or could it be that most posters here that want to keep the extra complexity hardly ever fly – and when they do, it is good fun making it very complicated?
Just a suggestion.
Note: There is a deliberate error in this post, let's see if you can find it!
The HSY - THK track, from memory, would take you straight through the Y20 route into BK (the old WATLE arrival)...
So there you are not monitoring the area frequency (on 121.5 instead), while an IFR aircraft inbound to BK could be in the solid deck of cloud above you (as you could be just operating clear of cloud), with either of you knowing what the other is doing.... Monitor 24.55, and bazinga, you both now can communicate with each other and the IFR a/c coming inbound won't have to have a heart attack in the process of not knowing what the hell you are doing.. We all know Sydney isn't exactly accomodating either with allowing you to cross those Class C steps out that way which doesn't help either.
I'm sure you know how it feels (as I have heard you in SHW on that exact WATLE track into BK), being told "Numerous VFR paints, random manoeuvres", with these aircraft 500' below you and meanwhile you're surfing along a layer of cloud. When it gets real close, it's not uncommon for SY CTR to either raise the aircraft/do a broadcast on behalf of the IFR a/c, and 9 times out of the 10, the VFR aircraft will reply and let them know they either have the IFR plane sighted, or tell the controller/aircraft what they are doing.
Although I guess going by your logic you want the whole TA for BK to be class E down to 700'.. Guess that means we have to fit all the non transponder aircraft with transponders.... geez thats extra cost for the GA flight training industry (but thats OK, maybe the chinese can help us out with those costs)
When I did some flying GA over in the states, a handy feature on the garmin units is the nearest ARTCC page... I used to maintain a listening watch on that, just like I would here by using the boundaries on the map.
Might I also remind you that below 5000' it is NOT a requirement to follow hemispherical cruising levels (it is a SHOULD not a MUST in the AIP). Therefore, and as has happened to me numerous times, the area frequency controller frequently provides safety alerts for two aircraft coming into close proximity (and with the invention of ADS-B, typically already knows the callsign of one of them and tries to raise them on the appropriate boundary freq). Going by your proposal of just listening to 121.5, how is this increasing safety/situational awareness what-so-ever?