Runway Heading
Thread Starter
Runway Heading
Can anyone point me to a reference for the Pans Ops definition of Runway Heading?
The FAA and JCAB both understand it to mean a heading flown as the runway identifier times ten (e.g off runway 36R at Schipol, you would fly a heading of 390 Deg Mag even thought he QDM is 354.) but common practice in Europe seems to be to fly a heading to make good the extended center line.
Obviously there is scope for error if, in parallel operations, different people have different perceptions of what they should be flying.
The FAA and JCAB both understand it to mean a heading flown as the runway identifier times ten (e.g off runway 36R at Schipol, you would fly a heading of 390 Deg Mag even thought he QDM is 354.) but common practice in Europe seems to be to fly a heading to make good the extended center line.
Obviously there is scope for error if, in parallel operations, different people have different perceptions of what they should be flying.
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FAA AIM
As per the FAA AIM "Runway Heading" The magnetic direction that corresponds with the runway centerline...Bla Bla Bla..but "Drift correction shall NOT be applied" If you center 044...fly 044.
Wizofoz, I tried doing what you say today on departure from 36R at AMS, but no matter how hard I tried I could never turn far enough to get onto 390 deg Mag!!! 
More fun than a spelling correction!
Actually, I agree with Jetdriver727, you fly the heading of the runway centreline, if you are asked to fly runway track, you apply wind correction.
More fun than a spelling correction!
Actually, I agree with Jetdriver727, you fly the heading of the runway centreline, if you are asked to fly runway track, you apply wind correction.
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Runway Heading and Runway Track are understood but could someone please enlighten me as to what is expected from ATC when the clearance is "On departure, climb straight ahead maintain three thousand feet".
Thank you in advance.
Thank you in advance.
Thread Starter
RM-LOL!!!
However, as I said, I can assure you that under some countries procedures, "Runway Heading" means just as I described (Without the typo!!). I nearly failed a check in Japan for selecting QDM instead of the "Whole number" heading. I'm suprised by Jet Drivers answer as I thought that was the FAA definition too, but either there are contradictory definitions about, or things have been changed.
Can anyone supply a reference?
However, as I said, I can assure you that under some countries procedures, "Runway Heading" means just as I described (Without the typo!!). I nearly failed a check in Japan for selecting QDM instead of the "Whole number" heading. I'm suprised by Jet Drivers answer as I thought that was the FAA definition too, but either there are contradictory definitions about, or things have been changed.
Can anyone supply a reference?
This has been covered in great detail in a thread about a year ago. I'd have a look for it, but I'm about to hit the sack.
Suffice to say that in TERPS, runway heading is just that - with no drift correction. In PANSOPS 'straight ahead' means you maintain runway track and correct for drift. The Americas, Japan, Taiwan and Korea use TERPS, the rest of the world uses PANSOPS.
Suffice to say that in TERPS, runway heading is just that - with no drift correction. In PANSOPS 'straight ahead' means you maintain runway track and correct for drift. The Americas, Japan, Taiwan and Korea use TERPS, the rest of the world uses PANSOPS.
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Either way, an important point is that in the event of a go around or eng fail on take off, the center of your protected airspace is the extended runway centerline. Where I work they teach to fly the extended centerline. This make sense as you would be takeing a risk, allbeit a small one, by maintaining heading in a strong crosswind for a single engine go around which is straight ahead
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Actually, Japan deviates from TERPS on this one. Here "Runway Heading" is the runway rumber x 10, eg Runway Heading for RWY 32 is 320 degrees. Not very different in practice, but JCAB is pedantic.
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"Maintain rwy heading" on a departure clearance means that you should apply a drift correction to maintain rwy track..........exceptions: Australia, USA and Canada (fly rwy heading without drift correction).
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Interestingly, in the following (Australian) Radar SID, the PIC is required to TRACK the runway direction until 600FT, at which time revert to the assigned HEADING. Theoretically, an assigned heading of, for example 016 off of RWY 01 in a howling Noreaster (admittedly rare) would se the aircraft drift quite few degrees at the magical 600FT mark:
http://www.airservicesaustralia.com/...BNDP01-104.pdf
http://www.airservicesaustralia.com/...BNDP01-104.pdf
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Long time since I've needed to worry about this but there is a certain similarity with RADAR headings. When a controller gives a RADAR heading, that's the one he (or she) expects the "paint" to make on the PPI. It isn't necessarily the one the driver should be seeing on the DI. That's one reason why the fact it is a RADAR heading is stressed. As a tower controller handling a missed approach, "climb straight ahead" expected just that: along the extended centreline.
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Straight ahead it's similar with 'track' so apply drift corrections.
There are airports,if I'm not mistaken for ex CDG ,where you're specifically told on procedures to maintain rwy track.
If told to maintain rwy heading ,then you should not apply drift.If ,for ex ,rwy heading is 080 ,then select hdg 080 and maintain it,no drift correction required.
Adherence to these procedures is more important in areas with parallel operation,where airplanes must fly track or heading on departures,as instructed,but not both on the same time,which can result in loss of separation between airplanes,if high crosswind exists.
GBZ: so ,if at cruise ,you're told to maintain a hdg of XXX,and you see you have X-wind of 80 kts,for ex,you apply 10 deg correction to XXX? 10,or 11,or 9...
If this is the case,you're doing it wrong,my friend.
You should select XXX in the HDG MCP window,and that's all you have to do.
Sometimes ATC asks what's you're heading,then tell you to take 10 deg to the right...you apply correction also here?How much?...
There are airports,if I'm not mistaken for ex CDG ,where you're specifically told on procedures to maintain rwy track.
If told to maintain rwy heading ,then you should not apply drift.If ,for ex ,rwy heading is 080 ,then select hdg 080 and maintain it,no drift correction required.
Adherence to these procedures is more important in areas with parallel operation,where airplanes must fly track or heading on departures,as instructed,but not both on the same time,which can result in loss of separation between airplanes,if high crosswind exists.
GBZ: so ,if at cruise ,you're told to maintain a hdg of XXX,and you see you have X-wind of 80 kts,for ex,you apply 10 deg correction to XXX? 10,or 11,or 9...
If this is the case,you're doing it wrong,my friend.
You should select XXX in the HDG MCP window,and that's all you have to do.
Sometimes ATC asks what's you're heading,then tell you to take 10 deg to the right...you apply correction also here?How much?...
Thread Starter
bobrun and Alexban,
You have both just given totally contradictory answers. can either of you supply a reference?
You have both just given totally contradictory answers. can either of you supply a reference?
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I've searched the net,but no succes in finding a Pansops site,so ,next time on office I'll check some books..
My explanation is based also on our SOP,some thsd's hrs of line flying and also answer given to me by some ATC friends....
But,I'll check the books,and maybe I'll find a definite answer for you,page and paragraph....
I also want to find this,cause I'm surprised that there are pilots who apply drift correction when instructed to maintain HEADING ,thus not knowing or not making any difference between Heading and Track (check also definitions for these two notions..)
My explanation is based also on our SOP,some thsd's hrs of line flying and also answer given to me by some ATC friends....
But,I'll check the books,and maybe I'll find a definite answer for you,page and paragraph....
I also want to find this,cause I'm surprised that there are pilots who apply drift correction when instructed to maintain HEADING ,thus not knowing or not making any difference between Heading and Track (check also definitions for these two notions..)
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Alexban.
It may well be a good idea to check with a current Area or Approach controller. As I said, it's a long time since I was at school.
You are exactly right if you are given a specific heading to fly that heading. If you are given a RADAR heading, as I remember it, the controller expects to see your paint parallel with the PPI cursor on that heading. He can't give you safe track separation if you don't correct for drift. Fine if your all on the same compass heading and TAS.
I'll be interested now to know if I have remembered it wrong.
It may well be a good idea to check with a current Area or Approach controller. As I said, it's a long time since I was at school.
You are exactly right if you are given a specific heading to fly that heading. If you are given a RADAR heading, as I remember it, the controller expects to see your paint parallel with the PPI cursor on that heading. He can't give you safe track separation if you don't correct for drift. Fine if your all on the same compass heading and TAS.
I'll be interested now to know if I have remembered it wrong.
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Originally Posted by GOLF_BRAVO_ZULU
You are exactly right if you are given a specific heading to fly that heading. If you are given a RADAR heading, as I remember it, the controller expects to see your paint parallel with the PPI cursor on that heading.
I'll be interested now to know if I have remembered it wrong.
I'll be interested now to know if I have remembered it wrong.
RADAR heading is poor phraseology held onto by some Controllers. You should either be told "Fly Heading..........." in which case ATC doesn't know your heading, but if you turn to what they say they will adjust you by the phrase "Turn left / right heading....................." (used when they do know what heading you are on).
RADAR heading doesn't exist.
Going back to the original question - it's this confusion that caused the UK to abandon "Runway heading" a couple of years back, to be replaced with "Straight ahead" - a lot simpler as it means continue out on the runway track, adhering to the track of the extended centreline.