Cattle Mustering incl Training, Job Prospects (!) etc etc
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: australia
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to pohm 1
I'm to slow at typing to tap it all out but an experienced pilot is allowed to do
1/ 100 hours in any 16 day period if he has 2 days off in that period.
2/ 1200 hours in 365 days if he dosen't have 42 days free of duty and 1400 hours if he has the 42 days off.
for daily total he can fly the hours of daylight plus an additional half hour for the extent of duty time
an entry level pilot can do
1/ 10 hours in a day
2/120 hours in 30 days
3/ 1200 hours in 365 days
this might seem a lot but i can assure you its very good in practise and when in the groove not a poblem
I'm to slow at typing to tap it all out but an experienced pilot is allowed to do
1/ 100 hours in any 16 day period if he has 2 days off in that period.
2/ 1200 hours in 365 days if he dosen't have 42 days free of duty and 1400 hours if he has the 42 days off.
for daily total he can fly the hours of daylight plus an additional half hour for the extent of duty time
an entry level pilot can do
1/ 10 hours in a day
2/120 hours in 30 days
3/ 1200 hours in 365 days
this might seem a lot but i can assure you its very good in practise and when in the groove not a poblem
Rather you than me. 5 hours straight in a jetty and I'm stiff and sore, but I suppose it all comes with experience. After 10 hours in an R22 do you sleep in a seated position?
Join Date: Jan 2003
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I really do appreciate all the advice. I have to confess that I don't have as much interest in cattle as I do in flying. I like the idea of being able to fly all day, every day. I also enjoy camping/sleeping out under the stars and roughing it. Money isn't as important as I've got a bunch.
Big Russ
No appology needed. It sounds like you've got the real story going. Interesting that I'd be spending 300 hours with another pilot to get trained...... That seems like a lot. I must be missing the complexity of the job..... I really don't mean to be insulting here but aren't we just talking about flying helicopters and hearding cattle? Is the type of low level flying the large part of this or is there a total picture that includes.....(I'm totally guessing here)
Cattle Specific
- knowledge of cattle
- knowledge of the industry
- Mustering objectives (is it just moving them from point a to point b?)
- maybe "how to heard cattle effectively without trama"?
- other?
Flying Specific
- adjustment to all dead mans curve flying
- specific techniques
- knowledge of the terrain
Don't feel like you need to answer but I'm still interested. The idea of being mostly alone works for me. The idea of dealing with tourists......well..... I might just stick to flying from my home in the city to my property in the country
Big Russ
No appology needed. It sounds like you've got the real story going. Interesting that I'd be spending 300 hours with another pilot to get trained...... That seems like a lot. I must be missing the complexity of the job..... I really don't mean to be insulting here but aren't we just talking about flying helicopters and hearding cattle? Is the type of low level flying the large part of this or is there a total picture that includes.....(I'm totally guessing here)
Cattle Specific
- knowledge of cattle
- knowledge of the industry
- Mustering objectives (is it just moving them from point a to point b?)
- maybe "how to heard cattle effectively without trama"?
- other?
Flying Specific
- adjustment to all dead mans curve flying
- specific techniques
- knowledge of the terrain
Don't feel like you need to answer but I'm still interested. The idea of being mostly alone works for me. The idea of dealing with tourists......well..... I might just stick to flying from my home in the city to my property in the country
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: australia
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SFHeliguy
I wish i had a bunch of money
you are are right and there is a total picture like any job.
The low level flying is no big deal, most of the time you are around 200 ft agl and travelling at around 50 knots but occasionaly you have to place the machine in a certain position to make the stock do what you want.
You have to be able to be at this critical point with speed and acuracy ASAP.
The big thing is knowing where this CP is and it takes a lot of training to recognise that, the other thing is being able to handle the machine skilfully enougn to achieve the CP.
To give you an idea a usual muster in north australia could be with 2500 head of cattle in a paddock that is 25 kms wide and 30 kms long thats if there is a fence. There would be 1 or 2 helicopters and a stock camp of around 7 men mounted on horses and bikes. The cattle would be worth about $1,000,000 and are a valuable asset that have to be got in and processed ie. some would go to market and some branded , that sort of thing. If the pilot makes a bad decision it is possible to lose all the cattle back into the paddock and really wreck your day. If this should happen it costs a lot of money, the calves get mismothered, the cattle get stuffed up and wont respond to the helicopter the next muster. you would have to leave that muster for at least 2 weeks to give the cattle time to settle down before you could try again and your success rate would not be so hot. A muster like this can take 12 hours of chopper time at $400.00 ph, 7 men at $200.00 per day each.
May not be be big figures in the rest of the world but everything is relative.
Competion is pretty fierce and if you stuff up the stations will very quickly get somene else. A fair few of them have done many thousands of hours as a passenger mustering and are able to recognise when things are going wrong, vise versa some cattle are pretty well unmusterable and need shooting so there are a lot of variables.
We like to start pilots off carefully if possible and get them as competent as we can.
300 hours would usually only take 3 or 4 months
I wish i had a bunch of money
you are are right and there is a total picture like any job.
The low level flying is no big deal, most of the time you are around 200 ft agl and travelling at around 50 knots but occasionaly you have to place the machine in a certain position to make the stock do what you want.
You have to be able to be at this critical point with speed and acuracy ASAP.
The big thing is knowing where this CP is and it takes a lot of training to recognise that, the other thing is being able to handle the machine skilfully enougn to achieve the CP.
To give you an idea a usual muster in north australia could be with 2500 head of cattle in a paddock that is 25 kms wide and 30 kms long thats if there is a fence. There would be 1 or 2 helicopters and a stock camp of around 7 men mounted on horses and bikes. The cattle would be worth about $1,000,000 and are a valuable asset that have to be got in and processed ie. some would go to market and some branded , that sort of thing. If the pilot makes a bad decision it is possible to lose all the cattle back into the paddock and really wreck your day. If this should happen it costs a lot of money, the calves get mismothered, the cattle get stuffed up and wont respond to the helicopter the next muster. you would have to leave that muster for at least 2 weeks to give the cattle time to settle down before you could try again and your success rate would not be so hot. A muster like this can take 12 hours of chopper time at $400.00 ph, 7 men at $200.00 per day each.
May not be be big figures in the rest of the world but everything is relative.
Competion is pretty fierce and if you stuff up the stations will very quickly get somene else. A fair few of them have done many thousands of hours as a passenger mustering and are able to recognise when things are going wrong, vise versa some cattle are pretty well unmusterable and need shooting so there are a lot of variables.
We like to start pilots off carefully if possible and get them as competent as we can.
300 hours would usually only take 3 or 4 months
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Australia
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SFHeliguy
ive only been in the territory for 15 months but during the season there is at least a pilot a week asking my work for a job mustering. i was one of them.
the 300 hours big russ talks about also includes getting to know the station owners, earning their trust (ability to make them money) so they might fork out that $400 per hour for YOUR time.
i do the tourist thing, not as much hours a season but still not bad either, plus it's 8 to 5 not dawn till dusk. yes i have been mustering quite a few times and the FUN definantly wears off after a (
) while.
the 300 hours big russ talks about also includes getting to know the station owners, earning their trust (ability to make them money) so they might fork out that $400 per hour for YOUR time.
i do the tourist thing, not as much hours a season but still not bad either, plus it's 8 to 5 not dawn till dusk. yes i have been mustering quite a few times and the FUN definantly wears off after a (
) while.
8 to 5?
What about sunrise/sunset flights? They are popular with the tourists at Ayers Rock, (not so popular with the pilot who does the daily inspection for sunrise though!)
Bugsmasherdriverandjediknite
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Location: Bai, mi go long hap na kisim sampla samting.
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Trust me, I speak from experiance. You do not want anything to do with cattle, station hands, dust, remote locations and wizzing around in that part of the graph that is hatched. along with this goes flys in unimaginable quantitys, weird cooks, sleeping with all sorts of strange wild life in your swag, the unbearable heat, thermals that will make your eyes bulge, the lack of wimen, the beer that aint the one you normally drink and so on.............. God I love my job, I just wouldnt recomend it to anyone. 
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Heli Mustering
There's a Discovery Channel programme about cattle mustering in Australia. It was on at 2300 on Christmas Eve and was one of the best things about Christmas.
It mentioned an annual flying total of 1500 hours (my copy of CAP371 wilted in my hands). The people being interviewed were continually waving flies away. From the few hours I have in R22s I remember that if I could see the cyclic move I was overdoing it, but in the footage the program had it was leaving weals on both the pilot's thighs simultaneously. It showed them eating breakfast in the dark, and it was fried calfs' brains. One bloke had been a ground-based cowboy for six years before his Dad, the station owner, would pay for his training. Listening between the lines, it was a (beep) hard job.
But flying is flying...
It mentioned an annual flying total of 1500 hours (my copy of CAP371 wilted in my hands). The people being interviewed were continually waving flies away. From the few hours I have in R22s I remember that if I could see the cyclic move I was overdoing it, but in the footage the program had it was leaving weals on both the pilot's thighs simultaneously. It showed them eating breakfast in the dark, and it was fried calfs' brains. One bloke had been a ground-based cowboy for six years before his Dad, the station owner, would pay for his training. Listening between the lines, it was a (beep) hard job.
But flying is flying...
Join Date: Mar 2001
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I remember watching that program. Very good.
There was a new guy who unfortunately got himself into vortex ring and stuffed it in. Managed to walk away from it but it was very sobering to see the pics of the R22 afterwards.
I came away from watching it with the utmost respect for these guys.
There was a new guy who unfortunately got himself into vortex ring and stuffed it in. Managed to walk away from it but it was very sobering to see the pics of the R22 afterwards.
I came away from watching it with the utmost respect for these guys.
Join Date: Jan 2003
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OK, OK, Allright already 
So, New posting:
All,
I'm interested in a reasonable hamster mustering job in Northern California.
Does anyone know how I get started?
All kidding aside, thanks to everyone for the comments. I'm going to go back to trying to determine what's the possibility for teaching....
matthew
So, New posting:
All,
I'm interested in a reasonable hamster mustering job in Northern California.
Does anyone know how I get started?
All kidding aside, thanks to everyone for the comments. I'm going to go back to trying to determine what's the possibility for teaching....
matthew
Guest
Posts: n/a
Mustering lecture.Any advice
Hi guys and gals
I am in the process of taking my CFI course here in the US. I have been given the task of preparing and researching the subject of "animal mustering" (all kinds), and would really appreciate some input from the good folks that have done it. I used to have an Aussie freind when I was in Canada, who told me of some of the work, pro's and cons. As a Brit' we don't get a lot of exposure to this skill. Any info that you think should be put in to a short talk would be welcomed. Also looking for a sort video file (20 - 30 seconds)
Thank you for your time
A_B
I am in the process of taking my CFI course here in the US. I have been given the task of preparing and researching the subject of "animal mustering" (all kinds), and would really appreciate some input from the good folks that have done it. I used to have an Aussie freind when I was in Canada, who told me of some of the work, pro's and cons. As a Brit' we don't get a lot of exposure to this skill. Any info that you think should be put in to a short talk would be welcomed. Also looking for a sort video file (20 - 30 seconds)
Thank you for your time
A_B
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bigruss has made some excellent posts in this topic.
Click here for one of the threads. There may be others.
Click here for one of the threads. There may be others.
Last edited by Heliport; 9th Apr 2003 at 23:08.
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Don't know if it helps but "Discovery Channel" did an hour long special on animal mustering in Australia using Robinson22's, it was called "DEAD MANS CURVE", you could try contacting them.
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Here are a few pics from my days heli-mustering in the Northern Territory.
There's an article here that might help you. It's not an aviation site, but it might help 'set the scene' in your talk.
Tudor Owen
Then the phone rang and I woke up.
There's an article here that might help you. It's not an aviation site, but it might help 'set the scene' in your talk.
Tudor Owen
Then the phone rang and I woke up.
Last edited by Flying Lawyer; 11th Apr 2003 at 19:15.
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Never heli-mustered but did plenty on bikes and horses.
Early mornings, late nights, use the fenceline, always drive to boreholes whenever possible and be prepared to not eat beef for a year once you finished your tour. Use your fellow jackaroo's (cowboy, to non convicts) toothbrush to kill the frogs in the Belgian sized shower, when you're near one in order to keep King Brown (not James), Tigers and Taipan snakes away. And take it from me that a one tonne bull can jump a five bar gate without knicking his testiculaaars as long as you leave it right at the last moment before jumping on the f!!!"*'/??S back. Good luck.
Early mornings, late nights, use the fenceline, always drive to boreholes whenever possible and be prepared to not eat beef for a year once you finished your tour. Use your fellow jackaroo's (cowboy, to non convicts) toothbrush to kill the frogs in the Belgian sized shower, when you're near one in order to keep King Brown (not James), Tigers and Taipan snakes away. And take it from me that a one tonne bull can jump a five bar gate without knicking his testiculaaars as long as you leave it right at the last moment before jumping on the f!!!"*'/??S back. Good luck.
Ahhhh ... thanks Flying Lawyer for the shot of the ar$e end of a brahman (thats the cow team...
)
Brings tears to my eyes and repentance to my heart for ever thinking twins are boring
Sure miss the country thou...absolutely unique and magical.
Aussie Aussie Aussie......
)Brings tears to my eyes and repentance to my heart for ever thinking twins are boring
Sure miss the country thou...absolutely unique and magical.
Aussie Aussie Aussie......
