Civilian repatriation to Brize

[AirportsEd]

Excellent post Wander00; entirely appropriate.

[JointShiteFighter]

Wander00, I couldn't have put it better.

Without wanting to politicise this, the deaths of these people was a direct result of our involvement in the Middle East and giving the victims a full, military repatriation ceremony was the least we, as a country, could do.

An outstanding effort from all those involved at Brize.

[Training Risky]

Hmmmm...I wonder who may come off better in the forthcoming SDSR?

Large fleets of heavy tanks and bridge laying eqpt vs Typhoons and GR4s with an extended OSD and tons of PGMs...

My my, Strike Command must be rubbing their hands with glee!

(also, I tip my hat to the RAF PR machine: the top 2 news items yesterday featured a C17 (Tunisia) and a GR4 (Aki))

[Haraka]

I was at Luqa in 1969 when a Greek C-47 came in to repatriate a Greek Officer who had died in post.
I confess I felt a bit awkward standing at the salute as the coffin approached the open door, being bounced along on the prongs of a fork lift truck.
The dead deserve as much dignity as is possible and this was given by the RAF.

[Tankertrashnav]

I hope a little thread drift will be permitted, but as the Queens Colour Squadron has had a mention or two on this thread it may be of interest to anyone in London over the next few days that QCS will be mounting guard at Buckingham Palace on the 4th, 6th, 8th, 9th and 10th of July. Except on the first date the Band of the RAF Regiment will be in attendance for the Changing of the Guard ceremony.

[Wander00]

Good luck to them. Regret I cannot get there to watch as I will not be in UK until 10th. Hat doffed

[Exascot]

OK all points taken and accepted. And, yes air pig I know. Exascot backing down - rare!

One point however HRH The Princess of Wales came back in the hold of an aircraft. Before anyone says she was not HRH at that point, I know but in my mind she was.

[hunterboy]

(Pulling pin and counting to 3)
Could it not be argued that the Brit civilian is almost taking the same risks as a serviceman nowadays in this era of asymmetric warfare? Don't they deserve a similar respect when repatriated? After all, these guys were innocently minding their own business, and not overseas looking to do harm to HMG's latest bogeymen.
If one wanted to be cynical, it's almost like HMG want the UK to be on a semi permanent terror alert to be able to control the population.

[NutLoose]

One point however HRH The Princess of Wales came back in the hold of an aircraft. Before anyone says she was not HRH at that point, I know but in my mind she was.

The VC10 fit though was not a run of the mill, shove it in and strap it down..

I much prefer seeing ordinary members of the public treated this way than some so called VIP simply because their job was in the public eye. After all it is their Air Force as much as the next man or womens, no matter their rank or stature.

[Wander00]

Exascot - but when Diana came back the "system" was fortunately not as well practised as it sadly has become. Furthermore, I suspect there were members of the Royal family who at that time would have done anything to ensure as little publicity and recognition as possible. In the following days, Joe Public showed how wrong they were (and in case you had not guessed, I have always been a huge supporter of "lady Di".) A book well worth a read, to digress, is "The Duchess",the biography of Georgiana, Duchess of Devonshire, one of Diana's ancestors. The comparisons are quite surprising.

[Exascot]

NutLoose, Not that it is relevant but it was a Queen's Flight BA146, one would be pushed to get a VC10 into NHT. For the record they parked discreetly out of view to turn the coffin in the hold before coming onto the apron so that they could bring her out head first. Mrs Exascot was the duty local controller on that sad day.

[teeteringhead]

And in the Diana case, the plan had then (fortuitously) only recently been rewritten, although with the Queen Mum in mind......

ISTR the plan names were all bridges for some reason.

[NutLoose]

Thanks Exascot, the only one we really dealt with during my time on the Ten was the Dutchess of Windsor.
It was a sad day and agreed still HRH in these eyes too, I could never undertand how you could strip that title from the mother of the future King.

[Wander00]

Purely personally (and I can almost hear the black Omegas revving up) IMHO it was a bl@@dy cheek to deprive Diana of HRH status, given the behaviour of the other party, which after all (allegedly)was the root cause of the divorce (But let's not go there)

[Genstabler]

The sainted Diana became HRH on account of her marriage to a Prince. When she was no longer married to a Prince she was no longer entitled to it. Same with Fergie. And there was fault on both sides, as is the case in most broken marriages. Get over it.

[Wander00]

Whoooops!!

[Shack37]

(Pulling pin and counting to 3)
Could it not be argued that the Brit civilian is almost taking the same risks as a serviceman nowadays in this era of asymmetric warfare? Don't they deserve a similar respect when repatriated? After all, these guys were innocently minding their own business, and not overseas looking to do harm to HMG's latest bogeymen. If one wanted to be cynical, it's almost like HMG want the UK to be on a semi permanent terror alert to be able to control the population.

No pin, just a request to explain how you can equate a holidaymaker with a serviceman/woman, on a duty tour in harms way, for us civilians?
I have no objection whatsoever with these victims of this atrocity being repatriated and met with dignity by the RAF.

[Basil]

My tuppenceworth:
The whole thing is largely a statement of political will.
Whether or not one agrees with, e.g., the minute's silence, that is, IMHO, what it's all about.

[unclenelli]

I can't help but think, why not save them all up and do 1 later repat to UK and save the fuel?
A C17 can easily take 30 coffins + associated handing pax

The only reasons I can think of - there aren't enough undertakers/hearses/morgue space in Oxon (to deal with additional load over & above natural death rate) or speed of ID-ing victims in Tunisia.

[smujsmith]

There's no reason why the AT fleet, in the guise of the C17 operators can't do this repatriation, and, I take issue with those who misguidedly believe that the repatriated bodies are being given "full military honours". The reception party at BZN provided by QCS is respectful and in accordance with the standard respects shown by a serviceman to any funeral cortège. I do agree that the C17 is capable of repatriating all of the victims in one run, rather than 3 or so. I rather suspect that the delay is down to political direction, rather than RAF planning. I have also read that all costs incurred by the RAF in this operation, will be recompensed by the tour operator who provided the holidays. Finally, I think of the seriously injured people who were the first evacuees returned by C17, a team unfortunately highly capable of transporting casualties of gunshot wounds, to a hospital well used to helping them. It all reflects on the RAF very well, spreading the load over 3 days smacks of certain politico's trying to "drag out" their exposure to the media. I hark back to one incident that set a precedent for me. I was serving at Akrotiri when the Turks invaded in the early 70s. Newly married my wife was evacuated back to UK on a VC10, two weeks after we were called on to base. I well remember seeing the families club, stuffed with British passport holders, as we were required to sit for 4 hours with no water or food in a very hot climate. The holidaymakers and Nationals with British nationality were given first priority on flights returning to UK, our wives and families had to wait. I'm sure many will remember it, I'm sure anyone who served during that time will accept that sometimes, the non combatants should have the priority, the RAF does after all belong to the British public.

Smudge