Parachute Aircraft lands in the water

[QNIM]

Gday

Just heard that they dumped a182 in the water off Torqay Airport this afternoon pilot is reported OK, it seems they just keep busting aircraft down that way.

Cheers Q

[Angle of Attack]

ABC News Website;

Two survive after plane dives into ocean

A pilot and passenger have escaped unhurt after a light plane crashed off Torquay on Victoria's south-west coast.

The Cessna-172 crashed into the sea about 500 metres off Whites Beach, around 1pm AEDT.

The 19-year-old pilot from Sunbury was taken to Geelong Hospital and treated for shock and minor injuries.

The passenger was treated at the scene.

Senior Constable Carla Coslovich says the pilot was trying to land at the Torquay airstrip after the plane's engine failed.

"At around 200 feet it lined up for another approach to land, again the engine failed and the pilot unfortunately had to put the aircraft down as there was not enough altitude and it landed into the white water, which caused the aircraft to flip," she said.

She says the crew of a police plane witnessed the accident.

"They actually saw this single engine Cessna-172 in the air and it looked like its engine failed around 10,000 feet, they saw that the aircraft and its pilot were attempting to land at the Torquay airstrip."

[Soulman]

Ok... I'll bite

"They actually saw this single engine Cessna-172 in the air and it looked like its engine failed around 10,000 feet, they saw that the aircraft and its pilot were attempting to land at the Torquay airstrip."

Yes... a 172 at 10 grand on a 36C day...

I think Carla Coslovich may still be getting over the two beers she had on Christmas day.

Cheers,

Soulman.

[accc]

hi QNIM at least he got off the ground before he crashed:O

[QNIM]

I shall try again

Pilot escapes crash unharmed
AAP
December 27, 2005
A PILOT escaped unharmed today when his light plane crashed into the ocean off a Victorian coastal resort town following an apparent engine failure.

The four-seater Cessna 172 aircraft plane crashed and flipped about 500m off Whites Beach at Torquay, 100km south-west of Melbourne, about 12.40pm (AEDT). Police believe the pilot, a 19-year-old man from the Melbourne suburb of Sunbury, was trying to land at Torquay when the accident happened.

"The engine failed at 10,000 feet (3048m), but the pilot was able to stabilise and was attempting to land when at 2000 feet (610m) the engine failed again and he crashed into whitewater at Whites Beach," a police spokeswoman said.

The pilot was the sole occupant of the plane. He was treated for mild shock by paramedics. No-one else was injured, police said.

Water Police and State Emergency Service crews are working to retrieve the plane.

Police and air safety authorities will investigate the crash

[colonel cameron]

Should have stuck to the first story, it made as much sense.

A 172 in an unstabilised descent from 10,000 to 2,000 ft?

Police and air safety authorities will investigate?

I should hope they would, if only to find the passenger who appears missing from the first story.

[rmcdonal]

Q1. Why would you use a C172 for parachute opps?
Q2. How do you get a C172 to 10'000? on a 36c day with 2 pob? (it would take a long time)
Q3. How does a single engine aircraft have a double engine failure?at 2000 feet (610m) the engine failed again

Hows the pilot now? Thats got to scare the crap out of you.:uhoh:

[BaronvonChieftain]

Just saw the report on 10 News, it looked more like a 182, not a 172. The extra 70-odd horses would make all the difference at A100. Glad to hear no-one seriously hurt.

[Dogimed]

Without sounding too much like an armchair critic...which I am..

How could you miss an airport from 10k?

Dog

[nikademus]

I'm new here and only signed up 'cos a friend pointed to this link and I was nearby when it happened.

I had just finished an hours solo in the training are of Geelong when the call went out that this plane had gone in and everyone was on the radio calling for ambulances and emergency services.

I was landing at Barwon Heads in a c172, a few miles east. I had flown the coast just near where the crash occurred, but I didn't see the crash. Here's what I can tell you:

There were parachute opps happening at Toruay from 10k. I had heard one already drop earlier and another was underway. They were dropping in pairs.

It was blowing a howling northerly, maybe 35 knots at that altitude (2k) and that could reall mess up your base turn point. Best glide speed is 65 knots, so you might only have 35 knts ground speed. It was also rough as guts inland and quite dirty on approach. I left flaps at 30 on short final cos it was so blowy.
Torquay airport is quite a way inland. Although I have never landed there I would say it must be at least 1km from the coastline and I wonder what the hell anyone doing a forced landing would be doing over the water?

If it was the parachute guys, they were pretty casual with some of their radio calls, although better then some recently banned operators from this area.

and my whinge: I'm only a new pilot, but it really annoys me that parachutists have to drop on the runway.

If they were in a 172 it would have to be a hawk xp or something to get to 10k in that sort of time. I don't remember them ever making a call with aircraft type in it.

Of course I had told everyone I was going flying so they all freaked when the news came in.

Remember, all the above is from a low time pilot who didn't witness the event, but was nearby and is pretty clueless :)

Glad to hear they got out ok.

nicko

[karrank]

I did hear a Cessna meat-bombing from 10,000 at Torquay this morning. Am a little hurt he didn't mention his probs or hit the squawker. Is it possible his avoiding turn from said meat bombs took him over the water and he only found out the motor was no longer doing anything useful when he was in a position and level that left him few options?

[nikademus]

I'm not sure about the second run, but the first lot he dropped about a mile north of the arfield (away from the water) to allow for the wind. The wind had picked up by the second run. I heard a spiritied conversation between him and an aircraft tracking coastal at 4k and trying to avoid mincing parachutists. In the end the guy tracking coastal elected to head a couple of miles offshore and dodge the whole event.

nicko

[hair of the dogma]

definately a 182, recognised it when i saw it on the news, i wasnt in the captains seat but it does beg a lot of questions

cant ever imagine not making the field if engine failed on descent

pretty sad to see a plane you used to fly destroyed

suppose will just have to wait and hear the full story

are you gunna rebuild it benny?

[morning mungrel]

Did ya see the clowns with the tractor pull the engine out of the airframe????:rolleyes:

[heat]

It was a Cessna 182G first registrered in OZ in 1965.

[victor two]

Does anyone know the rego of the aircraft?

[VH-Cheer Up]

From the photo in today's Age, looks like DGY. And looks like a writeoff - very nasty kink in the fuselage.

The tractor that pulled it out of the drink is a red International Harvester, regd something-H 327, in case you're after that one for your collection.

The tractor boffins seem to have ripped half the nose off in the recovery.

With a 35kt northerly, and starting from 10,000, I'm surprised he didn't land it on King Island.

Still, any landing you can walk (or swim) away from...

VHCU

[QNIM]

Gday

Looking at today’s Herald Sun I notice that the photo of the pilot (caption, Kicking himself, the pilot is checked out by paramedics) is wearing the Tiger Moth World uniform shirt this after the management denied to the media that they, Torquay Airport had anything to do with the crashed aircraft.
The aircraft departed Torquay flown by a Torquay employed pilot with intentions of dropping the parachutes on Torquay and I imagine he was intending to land at Torquay because he was trying to call them all the way down.
Sounds like a load of cr@p to me, so that makes it the third aircraft written off in under two years by Tiger Moth World pilots, the mind boggles.
morning mongrel
Looking at the photo’s I don’t think they would’ve had to pull too hard to remove the engine as it would departed the mounts before they touched it
It is alleged from those at the scene said there was no fuel slick around the wreck.
Anyway another good old girl lost.

Cheers Q

[Woomera]

Herald Sun (http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5478,17674315%255E2862,00.html)

"It is expected the plane, which had taken off from the Tiger Moth World Adventure Park in Torquay, will not fly again ........."

That part of the report seems to be totally correct. :E

[OCTA]

Pass me a shifter and my biggest hammer.... It will fly again he's to much of a tight arse to scrap it... The engine was only about 300 hrs over TBO!
Wonder if I can save my carpet from it?
Maybe he'll give us a job putting it back together dogma?

[QNIM]

Gday Again

Just checking tonight’s telly guide and guess what’s on channel 7 at 8.30,

Air Crash Investigation, Flying On Empty.

An Air Transit Airbus runs out of fuel and has to glide to a power free landing.

Required viewing for somebody I think.

Cheers Q :O

[coitus interuptus]

Lets give the poor bugger a break QNIM. At 19 years of age he is but a fresh face novice. I'd say he was probably quite nervous (as the rest of us would have been) throughout the ordeal. It wasn't a perfect ending but lets cut him a little slack. He walked away from it and that is the main thing. Well done son.

Edited for sloppy spelling.

[Aerodynamisist]

Haven't seen anything yet to sugest that the engine failure was fuel related. Sure It's not un heard off to see a jump plane run out of gass but can't we give the young fella the benifit off the doubt untill the report comes out he is after all one of our coleague's.

[rmcdonal]

Don't know to much about meatbombing but im fairly sure you don't do it when It was blowing a howling northerly, maybe 35 knots
That seems just a little to windy. But you never know they do jump out of planes.....:hmm:

[MelbPilot85]

I agree with coitus and Aerodynamisist, cut this guy some slack. The speculation that this incident was the fault of the pilot, without the facts, doesn't do the poor bloke any good. There is little doubt he could have handled the failure better, but hindsight is 20/20, and it is easy to talk about what he did wrong, and what he should have done instead, having not been in the situation yourself. For his sake, I hope he can put this behind him and move forward to make a successful career.

And like VHCU said "any landing you can walk (or swim) away from..."

[cjam]

It doesn't matter if it's 60kts up top, as long as you adjust your spot accordingly, let the meat bombs know so they can open low and get a wind check to make sure it's still below 20kts on the ground. not a problem.

[hair of the dogma]

without being too harsh not being able to land after engine failure after dropping the chutes ( on take off and climb i can accept you might get a bit far away ) is a bit of a cardinal sin

fuel slick - ha ha ha ha

35knot wind gives you between 30 and 100 kt ground speed in my books

even if it happened at worst possible place - downwind they should be flown high and you should be able to make it back

as for cutting slack there is a first time for everything in this place, nobody else ever got any around here and i sure wont expect any when i f@#k up (when not if)

[Tarboy]

QNIM,
Since there was no fuel slick are we to assume this was due to an absence of fuel in the tanks?
Tarboy

[compressor stall]

What concerns me most in all this is that the thread originator seems to be taking a great delight and pleasure in somebody else's misfortune. :mad:

[Cinders]

The germans call it Schadenfreude (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schadenfreude) .

The english equivalent is epicaricacy (http://www.answers.com/topic/epicaricacy) .

Either way, it just shows the character of the poster. :yuk:

[Tarboy]

I'm sure we all feel sorry for the pilot but not many people I know would feel sorry for his employer.
Tarboy

[QNIM]

Gday compressor stall

I feel greatly for the poor fellow, he has just started his commercial career and he would have been doing exactly what he was told and when he turned up at work he was probably introduced to Mr Shovel. I would be very surprised if he hasn't been advised to disappear. Tarboy obviously knows these people well. With GA the way it is these days the last thing we need is to have front page of every news paper in the state headlined with a wrecked aeroplane

From Todays Geelong Advertiser

Beach crash quiz

Thursday, December 29
Jeff Whalley

TORQAIR Tiger Moth World will have to explain to the nation's peak aviation safety body why one of its aircraft crashed into waves at Torquay on Tuesday.

Horrified Torquay beachgoers watched as the Cessna 172 ploughed into waves at Whites Beach and cartwheeled through the waves around midday. To the amazement of onlookers the pilot, 19-year-old Mark Giuliano of Sunbury, pulled himself from the wreckage of the plane virtually unhurt.

Police praised the actions of the young pilot for his presence of mind in controlling the descent.

``He has done really well to handle the plane as he did. It was textbook,'' Constable Nigel Bullas said.

Police would not speculate about the cause of the crash on Tuesday.

But yesterday Civil Aviation Safety Authority spokesman Peter Gibson said Torqair had been asked for a report into the accident by next week.

The Australian Transport Safety Bureau is also investigating the cause of the incident.

Mr Gibson said the authority would decide whether any further investigation would be needed after reviewing the company's report into regulatory procedures surrounding the accident.

``We look at whether all rules were followed, from safety to maintenance to refuelling,'' he said.

Mr Gibson said the first line of inquiry with engine failure was to examine how fuel was managed on the flight.

``It's an obvious starting point to ask how much on board and was there enough?''

The authority can levy penalties ranging from cautions to cancellation of licences.

I would like to see CASA get off there hands and do something about it and stop harassing those organisations who are trying to do the right thing.

There you are I’ve had my say.

Cheers Q

[inthefluffystuff]

Police say "It was textbook stuff" hell they had better stick to taking pictures of HIGHLY DANGEROUS DRIVERS OF CARS AND OTHER ROAD VEHICLES if that was texbook "Stuff" anyhow am glad the lad did not get injured as that is the most IMPORTANT thing.

Who in the he*l retrieved that a/c as it looked a proposition to fix up but if you got to take a look after the wankers pulled the engine out with a tractor and then bent the thing in half after towing it along the beach (hope they are insured against rough retrieval) that was probably text book stuff as well.

Why is everyone calling a 182G a 172 or has the text book got an inkblot on it?

Bloody keyboards, had to fix up some spelling.

[QNIM]

Gday Cinders

I think you’ve got it all wrong I don’t find any pleasure in seeing this sought of thing in the headlines as it definitely effects the industry, but those incompetents in authority who allow this to continue are destroying our industry, while we are trying build up confidence in the public and without that confidence we will all be looking for some other way to earn a living.
So rather than criticise why not get off your @rse and do something positive for GA
Have a nice day.

Cheers Q

[inthefluffystuff]

Compressor stall & Cinders

Hello, hello me tinks you are a little bit upset with the original poster? seems to be a bit of anomosity about your post? did you want to break the story first or is it a bit of long time trouble down your way?

Anyhow have done some research and found this Airport has had a history about it so all I can assume is that you are in some way involved and this is a bit of character attack to try and take the flak away from the event.

No one likes aviation to be headlines in local rags as they make a sensational front page with aviation the loser no matter what the outcome.

[Datsun180B]

TORQAIR Tiger Moth World will have to explain to the nation's peak aviation safety body why one of its aircraft crashed into waves at Torquay on Tuesday.

Last time I checked, the parachute ops at Torquay were run by a seperate company leasing a hangar. So please excuse me if i sound bewildered when I asky why Tiger Moth World has to explain the situation. From memory I believe the plane was cross hired from Queensland.

So who gets to do the most explaining with the nations peak aviation body.

1. The pilot
2. The Skydiving operator
3. The Airport operator
4. The Aircraft owner

Regards
Datsun

[inthefluffystuff]

Is that directed to Jeff Whalley Datsun 180B? or a shot at the Advertiser itself or another person giving it to the messenger whom posted the story Mr. Qnim, guess he knows how to create a storm by mere reporting the facts hey.

[accc]

Fluffy - i can say we are all sick of QNIM pretending that he is some sort of investigator and running off to the news papers in an attempt to put dirt on his EX employees who had good reason to sack him. i believe that this has included the MeatBombers,Torqair,Barwon Heads and Geelong should have sacked him when he crashed the Tiger!!!

Looking for the almighty dollar QNIM??


QNIM seems to be bitter and twisted with his attempts to gain revenge and has caused irrepairable damage to the aviation community in the Geelong area. Maybe Fluffy you can pull the chain on QNIM.


Good to see that the piolt in question in after mucking his approach choosing to land in the water than not on the beach and putting innocent beach goers at RISK. :D

[Tarboy]

accc,
There are a few inaccuracies in your attempt at character assasination.
I don't believe QNIM has ever pretended to be an investigator.
The newspapers approached him for comment as he has professional expertise and is an authority on operations in the local area having flown at most of the airfields there.
QNIM resigned at Torquay due to concerns with operational policies that put profits ahead of safety. His ex - employer then circulated the rumour that he was sacked.
His incident in the Tiger involved damage while taxiing the aircraft (without brakes fitted) at low speed. This can hardly be called a crash.
As for the bitter and twisted comment - I have never seen him happier.
Have a Happy New Year
Tarboy

[the wizard of auz]

C'mon POL. show ya self...........or are you already?.

[Towering Q]

nation's peak aviation safety body :yuk: :yuk:



Sounds like aviations version of the crack special operations group, or the elite tactical response group.

You can always rely on the media to 'dress it up' for the punters.

[inthefluffystuff]

ACCC


Now how and why would you expect me to pull a chain on someone I do not know as it could be a silly thing with a hell of a lot of comments then thrust on me for no good reason, I like to ask questions and form my own opinion from the answers that get posted.

I get the feeling that Tarboy may know him and he seems to give a good answer to the accusations put forward.

I have a terrible feeling that the fuel low mentioned could be a little true as that is the modis operandi for sky dive aircraft to help the climb and stuff an extra one or two in to reduce costs, boy that could open a nest of worms if they establish the loading and weight and balance on take off.

Still cannot understand why you would go out to sea when things are getting difficult and the age thing is a bit weak as licence tests do make sure of forced landing practice quite a bit during training an indeed on the actual issuing of the ticket to aviate. Anyhow it will show up if the investigation goes ahead.

[ilovemycessna]

Hello Ladies,
Looks like we have got another heated argument invovling the Geel/BH/Tor Ctaf. You ladies love you fight like schoolgirls don't you. Anyway not to agree with QNIM (because from most of his post he sounds like a bit of edit, Woomera but i can see where he is coming from. The company in which that pilot is "employed" have been very suspect for as long as i have been in aviation. There seems to be a common link, pilots employed by him crashing planes! (and breaking the law)! Think it's about time someone (ie CASA) payed them a visit.
I'll be looking forward to some reply's from TMW(ie accc)
Farewell Ladies
ilovemycessna
You're off to the sinbin for a couple of days. Zero Tolerance on name calling.
Woomera (Eastern States)

[QNIM]

Gday ilovemycessna
We are all entitled to our opinion and I except yours but going by your name you must be a sick pussy unless you get around in a Citation coz these days the rest are crapp, better known in the early days as Cessbuckets. Ok now that’s off my chest, listen darling the investigation division of CASA has paid them many visits in the last 12 odd years due to numerous accidents, incidents and reports from the public with recommendations to take action, which obliviously have been ignored by the weak gutted hierarchy because they still hold an AOC.
Gday accc
I think you forgot to add in your posts the fact that you both have a commercial aviation background for the last, was it fifty years?
Gday Tarboy
Thanks for your input I cleared out after a very short time because I could see my licence going down the chute or even worse somebodies blood on my hands and have been pursued through the industry ever since by those vindictive w@nkers.
Gday Wiz
Now you be nice coz I wasn’t naughty to you on the phone just pissed.
Anyway all you lot have a safe and prosperous new year.
Cheers Q ;)

[the wizard of auz]

Gday Wiz
Now you be nice coz I wasn’t naughty to you on the phone just pissed.

I was I was. and I suspect you didn't know it was me on the phone until to late. :eek:

[VH-Cheer Up]

TL, they weren't talking about this accident, they were talking about the 206 which went into a dam after take-off in Brisbane yesterday.

VHCU

[Rocket Rob]

Have been off this forum for awhile but the skydiving fraterinity seem to be in the hot seat as far as accidents go, hope they get a break from the bad run they are having!!!

[accc]

G'Day Tarboy, Ladies and Gents - whishing you a Happy New Year,:ok:

The newspapers approached QNIM............ please............... what did they do, Look him up under P in the white pages????

There seemd to be alot of rumours about QNIM being sacked at just about ever place that he has worked......Shame on those employers!!!!

QNIM...an authority?????!!!!! he has never held a position in running a airfield or business. I bet you would not be suporting him if he Taxied your Tiger when the wind conditions were known to be outside the limits of the aircraft, operator and withought sufficiant ground crew, Hardly responsable piloting.

My point that i made prevously was that the likes of QNIM who contiunally run to the press and politicans in an attempt to have his Ex-employees or competition shut down, damages the industry as a whole!

By including the politicans it puts undue pressure on the operators that do not relate to safety, if QNIM and others were generally concerned about safety, there are more proactive and positive ways where thay can work with there compeitiors and other aviation enthusiasts that benifets the industry as a whole!

To all thoses people who hide behind the word "safety" and "public interest" to then stick knives in the backs of aviation operators and enthusiats.......................KARMA......................

[Sunfish]

Rubbish Accc! You must know that the first principle of Australian business is to never let on when you are making money and always whinge about profitability.

I detect a certain element of that strategy here, as in the diving and similar liesure industries. For example, a scuba dive will cost you $65 at the Rip near Melbourne. Go figure the profits from an operation that can average 10- 15 divers twice a day 100 days a year (forget the weekdays).

I'd be interested to know what a skydive costs. We already know that it takes about 14-20 minutes to get to 14,000 feet, so what is the cycle time? How many dives can you do a day? Operating costs? My guess is that skydive operators are laughing all the way to the bank.

Their profitability is a direct function of how fast they can get the aircraft airborne and then back on the ground for the next load. That is a function of fuel load and the degree of shock cooling their engines experience on descent.

I'm not suggesting that the operator in either Queensland or Victoria has done anything wrong, but it appears that the skydiving operating cycle puts unusual and extreme loads on a piston engine. ie: A maximum power climb followed by imediate shock cooling on descent.

Maybe CASA needs to mandate turbine aircraft for skydiving?

[pall]

SUNFISH, I agree with you. I have recently watched a Cessna 206 operating out of RL Aviation, Ceres making a prolonged spiral descent from presumably 10,000. This cannot be good for a piston engine!

[dogcharlietree]

"How could you miss an airport from 10k?"
I agree. This guy was in the optimum position to carry out a forced landing.
Why then did it turn to sh1t?
Quite possibly due to lack of training! If he had not been trained in this procedure (from altitude) then you cannot blame him. You blame the system. (The sausage factory).

[VH-Cheer Up]

Good point Sunfish.

BTW Tug launched gliding ops have the same shock cooling problems, although they don't usually have such a prolonged climb - usually to between 3 and 6,000' is enough. But the cycle time issues are identical, as must be the thermal shock.

Why can't they descend under power - are they going to breach Vmca spiralling down from 10,000 with even as little as 1800 rpm to keep the temp up?

[185skywagon]

I have a couple of acquaintences who run jumpships. They have Digital engine monitors fitted, and say they are surprised how little power is needed to avoid shock cooling in the descent, compared to what they thought was needed.

[Sheep Guts]

Woomera,
This is starting to sound like a pack of Hiennas scrumaging for left over flesh on a Wilder Beast. It sickens me how people can make accusations after only a few days where now 5 people have perished.

Shame shame shame

Sheep

[185skywagon]

sheep,
that is the other thread. This is about the Vic Incident.

[QNIM]

Gday accc
If you cleaned your act up nobody would be worried about safety.
Cheers Q :D

[victor two]

Without doubt, skydiving ops would have to be probably the hardest environment for any aircraft to operate in. Lots of landing cycles, long and hot max weight climbs, high speed descents, usually lots of different pilots all doing things their own way, modified airframes to fit jump doors, lots of weird airflow buffet over the airframe tail sections from dragging jumpers along hanging out of doors and off wing edges prior to exits and all done in aircraft that are probably some of the older models operating in the country.

Makes you wonder why there are not more incidents really.

[Zhaadum]

VH-Cheer up,

I think you are referring to VNE not Vmca.

Using power all the way down increases speed to closer to VNE but give yourself a resonable buffer, and even slower in rough air of course. Never exceed any operating limits or you will come unstuck, sooner or later.

Keep the MAP at the top of the green arc and reduce it as required during the descent, as well as richening the mixture at the same time. Every 1000' or so. Cowl flaps closed 500' to level off in the climb helps keep the temps in the engine and if they are then kept closed during the descent until final you will have little or no shock cooling. In a C182 I routinely had the CHT 390F TOPC at A010 and it was still 310F or so 5 mins later on the ground.

Cheers!

Z.

[morning mungrel]

Once again, let's kick the !!!! out of an industry as a whole for the misbehaviour of a few. Exactly like saying all charter businesses are the same. They aren't. Not all DZ's are the same either. Everyone knows someone who got treated like !!!! at a DZ. Same as a charter company. What makes you think that further regulation would change any of the errant behaviour anyway? Oh I see, it works in the charter industry!! Hahahahaha. If you got treated like !!!! at a DZ, or they were shonks, or whatever, next time you point the finger at them, take a look at how many of your fingers point back ot YOU. What did YOU do about it?
It isn't difficult to get normal TBO engine life out of jump ships. All it takes is a little care, and forethought. Nothing else.
How did we jump to the conclusion that it was this fault or that fault? Oh, I know, it happened in the Three Ringed Circus, and everybody just knows that all the operators and pilots in the Three Ring Circus can't fly, or can't run a business, or can't play by the rules...........can they.

[accc]

G'day Pall,

your the classic example of what i have been talking about!!!!

where your s@#t stirring and politics got in the way of good airmanship.

Instead of landing at Torquay, you decided to crash in to the lake at Barwon Heads :ouch: Just to avoid the Golden Shovel Award!


You may have pulled it off if you hadnt got your power confused with your flaps=

I am still puzzled at why the Fat controller let you fly in the first place that day!

It's good to see your still flying and having a few beers at the bar:ok:

[the wizard of auz]

SUNFISH, I agree with you. I have recently watched a Cessna 206 operating out of RL Aviation, Ceres making a prolonged spiral descent from presumably 10,000. This cannot be good for a piston engine!

So if the guy you saw was getting about 18" MAP (full throttle height) at top of descent and maintained that and say 2200rpm in a spiraling descent with the cowl flaps closed........... how is that going to hurt anything????????. It aint going to shock cool anything at all. how is that going to be hard on the humble piston engine Pall???? how????. you been chatting to your little club mates RS480/POL,QNIM ect and just have it in for anyone that dares throw people from their aircraft for a quid?.
Sorry Q, couldn't help it. (now where did I leave that big spoon?).
Yawl have a Bonza day now. :ok:

[Sexual Chocolate]

Wiz >>> Forget about MP, RPM and Cowl Flaps. What we are talking about here is PROLONGED SPIRAL DESCENTS. It's a little known phenomenon in Australia but out there in THE REAL WORLD, everyone knows that prolonged spiraling damages an engine. Interesting to note that this also occurs when cutting donuts in boats and cars. Remember - extended rotational motion in ANY combustion powered vehicle is dangerous!!!!!

[scrambler]

My recollection of the Aust Parachute Federation Guidelines for drivers says not to do prolonged spiral descents. Wasn't this for a number of reasons, including the extra stress on airframes, engines etc, and the fact that you can't keep a good lookout in a 60 deg spiral?
Do some of the parachute guys read the manual?
I saw glider towing mentioned earlier, in the gliding scene tow pilots are taught good engine management and don't get to stay around if they don't follow the recomendations.

[QNIM]

Gday
Another article from the Geelong News
SURF COAST PLANE CRASH. HOT DAY TO BLAME: INVESTIGATION (how come every other aeroplane flying around the area that day didn’t end up in the water?) Mr Gibson said the Civil Aviation Safety Authority had recommended and would oversee more training for the pilot. The pilot would undergo additional training particularly in regards to gliding and what to do in an emergency situation. No kidding, BUT I JUST LOVED THE LAST PARAGRAPH. When Geelong News contacted Australian Skydive about the findings a spokesman said the pilot worked for Tiger Moth World at Torquay Airport, but Tiger Moth World said the pilot worked for Australian Skydive.
Seems like nobody at Torquay knows who’s up who and who’s paying the rent
They should make sitcom about that joint and you wouldn’t need canned laughter.
What a bloody crack up.
Cheers Q :)

[accc]

Good Afternoon QNIM,

I take it then that you were not responsable for the positive spin in the local paper, i thought you would be happy, wasn't that the reason that you contacted them in the first place?

I do admit it makes a good read!!

Happy New Year to you to!

[QNIM]

Gday
I think mentioned early that the pilot would be hard to find, it seems that wasn’t far from the truth.

From The Australian.
Young pilot silent on skydive plane crash
Natasha Robinson
29dec05
THE skydiving operators whose hired 40-year-old plane crashed into a beach at Victoria's surf coast had previously worked for a parachuting company that was shut down last year by the aviation regulator.
A director of Australian Skydive said yesterday that he had no idea why the engine of the Cessna 182, flown by 19-year-old pilot Mark Giuliano and carrying two parachutists, had failed.
But more than 24 hours after the crash, neither Greg Bayly, Australian Skydive's chief instructor, nor the Queensland-based owner of the plane had asked Mr Giuliano what had happened.
Mr Giuliano's mother said yesterday that her son, who escaped shocked but unharmed, would not comment.
But Mr Bayly said: "A plane is just like anything - it is a mechanical device ... I had a pushbike when I was a kid that kept breaking down. It was a mechanical device."
Mr Giuliano walked away from the plane, which crashed and flipped into the water after he attempted an emergency landing at White's Beach in Torquay on Tuesday. The plane had engine problems at 10,000ft before it cut out altogether.
Australian Skydive has been operating out of the Tiger Moth World Adventure Park in Torquay for just over six months. Previously, its directors worked for another company in the area, Skydive City, whose director Luke McWilliams pleaded guilty in court to 21 safety breaches after a Civil Aviation Safety Authority investigation.
Many of the CASA findings against Mr McWilliams were quashed by the Federal Court. No findings were made against other Skydive City employees.
Skydive City hosted the final fatal jump of Clare Barnes - the daughter of British Minister for Europe Denis MacShane and TV journalist Carol Barnes - who died when her parachute cords became entangled during a dive in March last year at Geelong's Barwon Heads, south of Melbourne. The accident triggered the CASA investigation.
Mr Bayly said the fact that he and other directors of the company worked had for Mr McWilliams's company Skydive City before it folded was irrelevant to this week's crash.
CASA has asked Tiger Moth, who employed the pilot, for a report on the incident.
Queensland aviator Alan McVinish said he maintained the aircraft himself in line with regulations and that he did not know what went wrong.
"I'm waiting for Mark to give me a call and tell me himself," Mr McVinish said. "It's a very well maintained aeroplane. We're in the dark until Mark starts telling us exactly what happened."
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.a...7681842,00.html
Gday accc
The only comment I have made to the media on this crash was when I was approached by one local paper, I have not contacted or made any other statement except on this forum. So I think it’s very naughty of you to suggest that I have, but saying that I think there is couple of interesting things coming up that might require a little press conference.
You all have a nice day.
Cheers Q