RAAF ATC Shortage ????

[Hatchet Harry]

Just a quick question for anyone in the know.....

Why is the Aussie Air Force sooooo short of ATC Officers ???

I was speaking to some recruiting people at a recruiting function for potential Aircrew and this problem was the point of discussion for a while and I'm really curious. I was considering having a go myself.... But I'm a little unsure if they are having trouble recruiting and retaining controllers......

Surely it's a great job.....

Where do they all go after their time in the RAAF ????

[Fox3snapshot]

The ADF provide an outstanding grounding and training facility comparable to or in some cases exceeding those professions in the outside world. Unfortuantely the ADF has never been able to keep up with conditions of service that match these commercial and private sector opportunities. This isn't just for ATC, but of course aircrew, engineering and other specialists.

Whilst the ADF has started to address the shortfalls with new incentives and a more touchy feely approach to personnel management, the floodgates were opened and playing catch up is proving very difficult.

In the case of ATC there is a world shortage, not just RAAF. There are some very lucrative contracts in the big wide world that can see almost 4 times the RAAF salary and some. Whilst it is not practical for the ADF to keep up with this sort of renumeration, specialist pay could be improved over the 15,000 AUD I believe is added to current controllers with the appropriate qualifications, which after tax is only a few more beers at the bar on Fridays.

The qualifications you earn from RAAF ATC give you opportunities to work in places like Air Services Australia, Middle East, Eurocontrol, New Zealand, Hong Kong, Canada etc. I have worked in 2 of those four and enjoyed a successful transition throughout, with the military background often helping in many situations (eg. Afghanistan and Gulf Wars in the last 3 or so years here).

I enjoyed the RAAF thoroughly and especially the people. I only left (as with many other controllers) because of opportunities that arose that have led onto bigger and better things, in my case here in the Middle East.

Remember also it is a lifestyle and personal issue and the expatriate or civil sector operations may not appeal to all controllers and the ADF will remain as their choice of employment for the long term.

Hope that sheds some light on the big picture.

Cheers and beers



:ok:

[ferris]

Fox3,
I need some info from you if you wouldn't mind checking your PMs please.

[Fox3snapshot]

Ditto.....

:ok:

[scran]

Well said Fox3.......................:ok: :ok: :ok:

[Fox3snapshot]

Its not often I manage to type anything constructive on here especially hitting the keyboard after a big night out.....there should be a breathalyzer system on my PC which will automatically shut it down in the event I try PPRuNing under the influence!

Hope all is well.

Regards
Fox3
:}

[CUNIM]

I don't know whether it has anything to do with it but recently I was over in Baghdad and heard that the Australian military controllers were being posted there.

:confused:

[scran]

CUNIM - Yes, we have a bunch of our guys running Baghdad Tower.

Also a couple in the Solomon Islands with our policing action there (supporting our Caribou and Iroquois).

In fact, I think the current leader of the Baghdad push must be getting pretty close to being the "most-decorated" ATC Officer we have ever had, having served in Somalia, East Timor and now Baghdad.

I also heard that we were asked to go to Afghanistan but declined the offer...........:O :O

[Fox3snapshot]

Scran....any chance of getting my medals and allowances for Desert Fox, Enduring Freedom and the latest chapter in Gulf Wars.

OK just a small detail that I am not serving anymore but surely you can pull some strings....for old times sake!

:E

[Barra Tuesday]

Fox3Snapshot, are you still floating around the middle east chasing young swedish netballers or has someone made an honest man of you yet? I guess they keep extending your contract which must be pretty sweet, so if you do manage to get Scran to get you those allowances (forget the medals - they wouldn't look any good on a T-shirt anyway) what about letting me help you drink them. Drop me an e-mail.

[Fox3snapshot]

Yeah good point about the medals on the T Shirt, definataly not been able to present myself as an honest man yet....has something to do with the Swedish Netball team, although I may be mixing them up with the team from Riyadh???!

Yup still here in the sunny Oman.....dooooh! I didn't mean to type that, guess that's why the Intel Branch never wanted me.

I will drop you a PM and see what's cooking.

Cheers and Beers
The Arabian Fox

:8

[TrafficTraffic]

Just to clarify a point RAAF ratings are not now nor have they ever been recognised by Eurocontrol (if they have been I am waiting for an example).

Nor do I believe do AsA, only to maybe shorten your theory a little.

With all due respect to our Military brothers I dont expect to hop into some ADU and start giving intercepts and other really cool Top Gun stuff without appropriate training - the same goes the other way round.

[Barra Tuesday]

Traffic, Traffic

Equally RAAF controller's dont work in Air Defence Units (I am assuming that is what you meant by ADU) and don't do intercepts (well not intentionally anyway):p :p :p
Interesting that AsA don't recognise ratings (well they do in a quasi way by giving RPL, which considerably shortens the course depending on which specialty the ex-RAAF controller is going to be employed in) however, other countries around the world do; NZ being a point in case I believe (is that right you NZ guys?)

[Fox3snapshot]

Here's the news mate, all bad really....

Sorry to blow your little bubble but your insulur concept on RAAF controllers and there "need" to do another course is, unfortunately wrong. I, myself, me, have not had to bother with the palava and can honestly say that when companies/organisations want you desperately enough the little four letter word on my licence (I might add one of the first courses in 91) that says ICAO, says that you can work....onto my third contract now.

Problems, questions.....take it up with ICAO.

Love,

TheFox




:hmm:

[TrafficTraffic]

Dear Dear Fox3,

I think you may be a little, how would one say, on a different planet if you think that I care whether a RAAFie has to do a long short or no course really bothers me.

What bothers me is people like yourself making comments on things which they have no idea about, Canada, Eurocontrol etc...

My insular concept of RAAF ATC (up until this point) was that these are some of the nicest guys and girls, doing a bloody hard job for little or no recognition. They were(are) very helpful and flexible in any coordination,

and if you read my post

Nor do I believe do AsA, only to maybe shorten your theory a little.

As Barra said RPL.

I am sure the fact that you are on your third contract reflects greatly on you


.companies/organisations want you desperately enough

[report_heading]

Hatchet Harry

RAAF ATC is no different from any other ATC organisations, it has its problems but it also has some very good points. The big difference is the employment conditions and its effect on your lifestyle. You need to ask yourself a few questions before you decide which way to go.

Do you want to make ATC your career or the RAAF?

Are you happy moving around the country side every couple of years to locations that you may not want to live?

What effects will moving have on your family (aging parents, wife, children - if you dont have them yet you might one day, schools etc)?

Having to spend considerabnle amounts of time away from home on exercises, deployments (RAAF ATC have been deployed to almost all of the recent conflicts and peace keeping deployments - normally about 6 months)?

Once you are in the RAAF, you need to give 3 months notice to leave, this can restrict future job opportunities.

Anyway just some things to think about. As far a RAAF licence being transferable it is very much dependent on the country. In Australia, Airservices will give RPL for your RAAF qualifications which will shorten the course by about half but you do still need to do a course (about 3 months). Crazy I know but that is the way it is at the moment. Check Airservices out as well before committing to which way you go, I think they will be advertising again for ATC positions through their website next month. Long term the pay etc is alot better. As far as the ICAO licence goes for the RAAF controller, I understand that it is no longer issued so it is just a few lucky people who were in the RAAF in the 90's that got it. I know some RAAF people had trouble getting a job O/S because of licencing issues. But Fox is correct in that NZ and Canada have taken direct entry controllers.

Finally, the RAAF does have its politics. It may be worth having a look at the D&G Aircrew forum to here some bitching about RAAF and ex RAAF controllers.

Good Luck with whatever you decide.

[Fox3snapshot]

The comment about companies and organizations wanting you desperately enough is reference to the fact that they are ALL short of controllers!

It goes without saying that most units are desperate!

The RAAF is short 75 or so controllers and I am sure with your worldy knowledge you would know how short NAV Canada, Eurocontrol, ASA and many other units are or will be.

And as for your referal to the 3rd contract reflecting on my professionalism, it was a comment to highlight the fact that I have had no problem with overseas employment on a RAAF licence. In a 14 year period I don't think 3 contracts is so bad....unless you believe it is ideal to rot in the same place for the term of your natural life.


:hmm:

[Hatchet Harry]

Thanks for the constructive replies....


I am pretty interested in joining the RAAF and becoming a Controller. For a single bloke who enjoys a bit of fun I'm sure the RAAF will keep me happy for a few years.....

I was always led to believe that even currently the RAAF training qualifies you for an ICAO licence ???? If that isn't the case isn't it a little futile to do 7 years and have no recognised qual outside of the military ???? If that is the case I'm not going to waste that much of my life......:confused: :confused: :confused:

I would be grateful to anyone who can honestly comment on the RAAF training and the ICAO licence...... :uhoh: :uhoh:

Thanks in advance,

Harry.

[Fox3snapshot]

The issue of ICAO accreditation is a little grey, however, the new ATC licence appeared in 1992 with a more formal ICAO recognition.

My RAAF ATC licence reads in part:

VIII. Issued in accordance with DI (AF), ICAO and CAA provisions, requirements and regulations.

The licence is signed by the sponsor of the RAAF ATC category who is officially a delegate of the Civil Aviation Authority.

The RAAF put a caveat on it though that it is only valid "for so long as the said person serves in the RAAF.

The way the caveat was circumvented by the civil unit overseas that employed me, was to hire me whilst serving in the RAAF which fulfilled their requirements for an ICAO licenced controller and the rest is history.

Don't base your decision primarily on the ICAO aspect as there is so much to be gained from serving in the RAAF if that is what you really want to do. There is so much change occuring in the industry that by the time you do get to your first RAAF ATC unit, policy and procedure could be completely different and you could benefit either way.


:O

P.S. If you get to the RAAF board possibly best not to dwell on what you will be able to get outside of the RAAF after 7 years.....best focus on getting there in the first place.

:ooh: