European AIS Database

[Mike Cross]

You are a user of aeronautical information? Read the following pages, they will change your life !
That's what it says on Eurocontrol's European AIS Database (http://www.ead.eurocontrol.int) website that went live today.

Unfortunately I can't tell you whether it will or not because I can't get into it. :{ It checks my Java Plugin, tells me that I have 1.3.1_06 and that I should have 1.3.1_04 and then won't let me go any further.

I've emailed them about this as I'm not keen on removing the later version put on my machine by Microsoft Windows Update.

Anyone been able to get in? Did it change your life?

Mike

[dublinpilot]

nope. Can't get in either.

I click go, and it just give's me links for IE 6, Java 1.3.1 and Acrobat Reader 5.5

It doesn't even tell me that I need updates, just seems to tell me how to down load and install these programs!!

[Mike Cross]

Intuitive isn't it?

You need to click the logo at the top of this page (http://www.ead.eurocontrol.int/eadexplorer/indexPU.html)

Mike

[englishal]

No, doesn't work for me either, just gets stuck on the Java Plugin Check page. I guess its a 5.10 MB download on my slow modem....oh well, got nothing better to do today :D

EA

[Rallye Driver]

I'm running a Macintosh, so I can't get into it either as the Apple java version is wrong too.

No change in my life then.

RD

[Mike Cross]

This page (http://www.ead.eurocontrol.int/status.html) indicates that ther should be useful stuff in there if only we were able to acces it.

Maybe they should offer a prize for the first person to actually get in.

Mike

[charlie-india-mike]

Can I claim the prize, I'm in using IE6 and whatever version of java it comes with.


C-I-M

PS I will let you know if I find anything useful.

[Evo]

I'm using Sun's 1.4.1 JRE, and it doesn't work. :( I can understand the requirement for a base level of JRE, but disallowing newer versions is nuts!?!

[bluskis]

Tried it, but it doesn't appear to like my security settings, so I will wait until it becomes indispensible.

[Mike Cross]

Gets worse. My machine at home has JavaScript Plug-in 1.41 like Evo so no joy there either.:{

Mike

[Evo]

Is there some ICAO article that says that if you've got AIS in your name then you've got to b*gger up everything involving computers... :confused: :* :ugh:

[Warped Factor]

Same Java version problem here as well :rolleyes:

WF.

[Keef]

Nope.

Tried it with Mozilla, and was told the version I'm using is the wrong one. it wanted me to use one from about two years ago (not even got a copy of that version any more). Mozilla updates about every six weeks, with daily builds for those who are really keen.

I tried with Internet Explorer and got a bit further - it told me I have not installed the correct Java plug-in version 1.3.1_04. I'm using 1.4.1_01.

Sounds very like past experience with AIS. Are we to assume Thales set up this fine essential software?

Maybe the old 486-33 machine in the Church office would work with it.

[rustle]

Anyone with a modicum of intelligence is using a firewall and/or NAT (address translation) software when accessing the internet via broadband, so this site can never work as configured unless your NAT software and/or firewall allow HTTP on port 80.

Fcukwit-"Eurocontrol" learned nothing from all the hard work UK-AIS non-IT people put into making the rubbish they bought from France functional...

Give up on it guys - no matter what software you download from links on the site it ain't going to work if you are 'safe'.

Dickheads, the lot of them.

[Evo]

Oh yeah, didn't actually bother to read that bit - I have this old-fashioned idea that web services and the like should just work. Who do the people who write this stuff work for? I'd probably get fired if I came up with a half-baked piece of rubbish like this :mad:

So C-I-M, was it worth it? I guess you've got an insecure internet connection and a JRE so full of holes that even Microsoft patched it... ;) :)

[rustle]

Evo - site tested on a dial-up connection no doubt.

In the olden days dial-up users were not on long enough, nor had the bandwidth, for nasties to be sent "upstream"

Today, believe it or not, people have broadband always-on connections and a direct consequence is that firewalls and NAT have become a necessity even for "surfers".

About time some content providers caught up from the days of teletype and secure networks (like AFTN) ;)

FTR, until recently the UK-AIS had the aerodrome plates in a directory that included the path "./ad/"

Looks harmless enough, but most advert blocking software (Norton/Symantec et al) saw "ad" and blocked it because that's where ADvertisements are stored, not AeroDrome data :rolleyes:

You'll notice they have changed the directory structure now, so no longer an issue with UK-AIP AeroDrome plates ;)

[rotorcraig]

Erm ... does this site actually do anything at the moment :confused:

I managed to get in and click around, but can find only what appears to be publicity and internal project documentation?

Didn't understand half of the acronyms, and couldn't find anything of immediate use to flight planning.

Am I missing the point, or is the site technically live but absent of any useful content?

RC

[drauk]

rustle, whilst I agree with nearly all of what you say (it must have been created by fckuwits - dreadful design, ridiculous requirements etc - who needs Java applets to make an interactive web site?), I think you're mistaken about the firewall stuff. If you can read pprune or any other web site then you are allowing HTTP traffic on port 80 outbound, which is all you need to use this site. You don't need to open port 80 inbound.

Anyway, as for if the site is of any use, hard to say, because right now it is giving a nice friendly Java stacktrace showing an Oracle java server error about too many open files.

[bookworm]

About time some content providers caught up from the days of teletype and secure networks (like AFTN)

It's a pity that the user interface for the public service is so poorly thought out. My impression is that, as a project, the EAD has been generally well run and has used appropriate, up-to-date technologies in the underlying architecture.

[Cahlibahn]

Frequentis are responsible for this abomination. it really is beyond belief that they could produce such rubbish these days. I finally got into the site after the fourth re-boot but can't find anything apart from a non-functioning menu.

[phil_ukga]

Alternatively, if you just want nice simple access to UK NOTAMs and weather for your favourite airfields (emailed to you as soon as they come out if you wish), check out:

http://ukga.com

And we don't ask you to jump through hoops and download the latest version of Java or anything...

[skydriller]

Apparently I have Internet explorer 5.5, not 6.....:hmm:
so it doesnt work. I clicked to get IE6 but its 25Mb, and this will take all day to download, so 'I aint doin it.' - broardband? we dont know what that is this side of the channelso,:p

So, what is on this site? any good?

Regards, SD..

[AC-DC]

Logged on the website, no problems, straight in. It seems that all European NOTAMs and maybe some maps/approach plats will be compiled and published there. The service will start sometime in 2004 with some participating countries and will be completed by 2006 when the remaining states join. Guess when the UK joins? :rolleyes:

[rustle]

AC-DC Logged on the website, no problems, straight in

I'd be very interested to know a few parameters:

What browser?
Dial-up or broadband?
Firewall? Brand?
NAT and/or connection sharing?

Here or PM would be very handy.

TIA

[Mike Cross]

AC-DC

My understanding is that UK AIS are already providing a NOTAM feed to EAD.

I also understand that cost is a relatively major consideration (as it appears to be with most things Eurocontrol).

The difficulties being experienced by myself and others indicate that Eurocontrol failed to deliver the goods on the advertised date. If I had decided not to join in on day one I might feel that I had made a good call.

Is there anything in there that is useful today or are we not going to see anything until next year?

Incidentally, a little nuggett of information I was not aware of. UK AIS only take the French International NOTAM, not the domeswtic series. Therefore if flying to France NOTAM from UKAIS will be good to your destination airfield. For onward flight within France you should check French NOTAM.

Mike

[rustle]

Maybe we should send two copies of this to EuroControl. (Think about it... :) )

http://www.nnbh.com/9043003603.jpg

[Aussie Andy]

Lousy, really lousy... I donwloaded their suggested version of the JRE, to be congratulated with a dialgopue box telling me I now have the correct version (hurrah!), but then the next page where I should see their system is just errors. I hive up before I start. Rank amateurs.

[Aussie Andy]

Decided to try again... the blank frames now start the process of downloading JAR files. As I type this, over 3MB has already been downloaded in 15 minutes... Hang on - its finished!

Essentially it lets me lookup NOTAM, much as www.AIS.org.uk does. In addition, it has some nice-to-have features, such as lookup NOTAM for an area defined as a radius, say 20NM around WOD NDB, for example. It also lets you select a sort order of your choice for the output, including "north to south".

I also tried the Route PIB option (this involves downloading yet another JAR file!)... you can select departure and destination aerodromes, as well as FIRs, but I didn't see a way to put in a route including turning points (NDB, VOR etc) nor a way to specifcy the width of the route, so its not as good as the AIS Narrow-route briefing for our purposes.

There's also something called "SDO report"... so I clicked it (well you have to double-click things in this interface for some reason...), and it downloaded more JAR files, but I could not fathom what this application is for...

Likewise when I tried something called "PAMS"... several more JAR files were download, taking several more minutes, ... in the end it seems to be a way to search the AIP (from which country?).. but is apparently not populated with data at this stage.

So the PIB (NOTAM) functionality is OK (the rest is useless) and this has some nice-to-have features, but I really don't understand why such a heavy client-side user interface is needed? This has many disadvantages, such as you'll have to wait for it to download whenever you use to a different PC, it takes ages, and it doesn't add any UI functionality (as far as I can see) which couldn't have been implemented via simple HTML forms!?!

Also, as they go through their bugfixe releases, I suppose we'll have to re-download additional or changed JAR files. This is just a stupid way to implement a web-GUI in this day and age, IMHO!

So, in short, not really worth the effort.

Cheers all,

Andy

[routechecker]

Sorry guys,

Ok, the interface is not that great but all the info is there.
In the PIB (Pre-flight Information Bulletin) you can get ALL of Europe Notam information either VFR, IFR or both, for aerodrome, , area or route.
In the PAMS (Published AIP Management System ) you have ALL the European AIP's and corresponding Ammendments, Supplements, Circulars and Charts). All you need to do is select the first two letters of the Icao 4 letter and hit generate.
SDO just gives you static data information, e.g. VOR's name, position, freq...

I'm preparing my navigation flight for tomorrow (still learning ;-)), and IMHO this thing is God sent (as long as you have broadband).

BTW, I got all the acronyms and the explanation of how the thing works by clicking on the question mark button. Amazing the amount of information those little things give away...

[IO540-C4D5D]

routechecker

Certainly the site seems to be improving.

BTW you need broadband just to use THIS website, unless you have the patience of a monk!!!! I wish this whole edifice was moved to Usenet, then one could use decent fast software to access it; www-based forums are at best pig slow.

[rustle]

Can anyone who has actually been able to get to the site please answer this?

I'd be very interested to know a few parameters:

What browser?
Firewall? Brand?
NAT and/or connection sharing?
How much old software did you have to install over newer versions?

[Aussie Andy]

routechecker: God didn't need to "sent" it [sic]... the existing www.AIS.org.uk system gives access to all European NOTAM and I used it to great effect for a recent trip to Europe WITHOUT the ridiculous JAVA client-side UI imposed by the new Euro-AIS system..!

Andy

[routechecker]

Andy,

Yes, but the old and tired concept of the majority of AIS information only being available if you pay for it is now gone. Remember that the majority of European AIP's had to be bought and if you wanted charts you had to "compensate" Mr Jeppesen or Mr Airad. Additionally on the EAD you have all the worldwide Notam's.
Like I said before the interface is not great but with broadband it's not really a handycap.

[Andrew Sinclair]

Finally managed to crack this little nut today. Entered this (http://www.ead.eurocontrol.int/) site, got all Java'd up and even managed to get a basic aerodrome PIB of my home airfield all the way from Madrid or was it Stuttgart?
Now for a more difficult route PIB and perhaps the ENR section of the UK AIP that was promised by the German gentleman on the streaming video introduction..........wish me luck!

For those "Doubting Thomas" amongst you here is a photo I took to prove it.

http://mysite.freeserve.com/andrew_sinclair/ead.jpg

If I don't return by tomorrow you know my last known position so please inform the D&D cell for me on 121.5 and send SAR!

[flower]

So are you making us all responsible people for you Andy,
thats a big risk :p

[Mike Cross]

What Andy didn't mention for all you budding programmers is that by using the Layout tab shown on his screenshot you can get the data in XML format. Something our own CAA have been declining to allow us.

You will also note the lack of any need for a username and password.

They have obviously made some changes since the site went live as I can now get in, which I was unable to do before.

Mike

(edited to correct spolling)

[Andrew Sinclair]

Yes of course the important point Mike.

Here is an example:
<QLine>
<FIR>EGTT</FIR>
<Code23>RO</Code23>
<Code45>LP</Code45>
<Traffic>IV</Traffic>
<Purpose>NBO</Purpose>
<Scope>E</Scope>
<Lower>000</Lower>
<Upper>040</Upper>
</QLine>
<Coordinates>4932N00153W</Coordinates>
<Radius>50</Radius>
<ItemA>EGTT</ItemA>
<StartValidity>0307021444</StartValidity>
<EndValidity>0309192359</EndValidity>
<Estimation>EST</Estimation>
<ItemE>FLIGHTS FROM/TO CHANNEL ISLANDS: PROHIBITED AREA 493220N 0015300W RAD 5KM 3400FT AMSL/SFC. SVFR ROUTE JERSEY - FLAMANVILLE AND GUERNSEY - FLAMANVILLE SUSPENDED UNDER 3400FT. CREATION OF A COMPLEMENTARY SVFR ROUTE. JERSEY - POINTE DU ROZEL (492859N 0015059W) AND GUERNSEY - POINT DU ROZEL (492859N 0015059W)</ItemE>
Admittedly it looks like gobbledegook, but the script above has the potential to be a circle on a graphical map with the associated PIB information in plain English alongside. A very useful intuitive tool for all GA pilots.

"Edited because my speeling isn't up to mich ither"

[Evo]

Admittedly it looks like gobbledegook

No, that's great - can we download it automatically, or do we need to fiddle around with the GUI?

now just need to get it into NotamPlot. I'll do the XML parsing if you're busy, Ian F! :)

[Andrew Sinclair]

Evo,

I am fairly certain this can be downloaded automatically. The reason I say “fairly” is that I am not an expert. I have recent investigated using Perl for automatically downloading from the UK AIS web tool AES and that works, so I suspect the same principles can be applied to this web tool.

It doesn’t need a password as was mentioned above and also there is a function which filters by radius so the user can put in a Lat/Long and a radius of interest. This is useful for FTOs. I haven’t fully investigated all areas of the site yet. I need to get a brief from AED and a brief from AES side by side to validate the PIBs are the same given the same filter criteria.

Still work to do but it has taken me a while to get to this point so I thought it worthwhile to post.

There is a library of all AIC/AIP documents also. I managed to view them but the way they were listed was difficult to understand although I may not be doing it correctly.

I’ll post again if anything worthwhile to mention.

[bookworm]

The EAD Public Interface is not designed for automated access. If it were driven by CGIs then you might be able to screen scrape -- yukky though that is, but it's written with the Java GUI and the security/authentication is incorporated in that. So the best you're going to get is cut-and-paste of output from the GUI. The XML schema are available on the EAD site library (http://www.eurocontrol.int/ead/library/software.html).

If you want real automated system-to-system access you have to investigate the ESI, the EAD Systems Interface.

[Andrew Sinclair]

Here (http://www.eurocontrol.int/ead/introduction/2136.pps) is a general overview of the EAD system and programme objectives etc.

[IO540]

That's a .pps file - what app is needed to display that?

[Evo]

Microsoft Powerpoint.

[Aerobatic Flyer]

I thought I was at least averagely computer-literate before I tried this site.......

After much effort, I finally got to the screen where I could look for a simple Aerodrome PIB (which worked for Andrew Sinclair).

After lots of thinking about it, I finally got a message at the bottom of the screen saying:

load: class com.teamead.ino.datauser.client.AerodromePIBApplet not found

I'msure it will be great if they ever get it to work! :) Couldn't they have done it a bit more simply, though.......?

[IO540]

Aerobatic Flyer

The answer is YES. But if you pay a website designer, he wants to show that you got your money's worth.

Putting Micro$oft Powerpoint objects on a general-access website is bizzare. Most private users won't have this prog. Corporate users will, it comes with Office 200x, cost some £400. No wonder B. Gates makes so much money.

[Andrew Sinclair]

If it helps I translated the Powerpoint file to an Adobe Acrobat file (pdf) and put it here (http://mysite.freeserve.com/andrew_sinclair/2136.pdf). It is quite a big file so might need to right click and use "Save Target As..." function and download it to your PC

Adobe Acrobat Reader can be downloaded from here (http://www.adobe.com/products/acrobat/readstep2.html)

[rustle]

Usual anti-MS/anti-Bill Gates rhetoric aside, there is a free downloadable PPS viewer on the Microsoft website.

So you don't actually need to spend £400 or £0.04 - but that isn't quite such a thrilling headline... :rolleyes: :hmm: :yuk:

[Andrew Sinclair]

It took me a while to get it sorted out so I sympathize with you there Aerobatic Flyer.

There is one point that is worth bringing up at this time and again it is the issue of this Q Line, sorry to bang on about it!

In the particular example I posted, this part

<QLine>
<FIR>EGTT</FIR>
<Code23>RO</Code23>
<Code45>LP</Code45>
<Traffic>IV</Traffic>
<Purpose>NBO</Purpose>
<Scope>E</Scope>
<Lower>000</Lower>
<Upper>040</Upper>
</QLine>
<Coordinates>4932N00153W</Coordinates>
<Radius>50</Radius>

contains all the information that is required by a s/w developer in order to present the information graphically on a map. This is the part that is currently removed from the NOTAM prior to them being placed on the UK AIS AES tool as PIB. This is the difference between a NOTAM and a PIB. At the moment NATS/AIS and the CAA are considering whether they should release the Q Line. As both organisations are necessarily very structured in their working practices it takes time to discuss the ramifications of releasing the Q Line before they make a decision.

The interesting point is that the Q Line information above came direct from AED to me, the Public User, via the internet and AED is owned and controlled by Eurocontrol, so they have decided it is ok to release the Q Line. It is hoped that the CAA are able to come to the same conclusion as Eurocontrol and release the Q Line. The CAA may not agree for a variety of reasons unilaterally specific to the UK and are of course entitled to make an their own autonomous decision on this issue. The release of the Q Line coupled with direct data from the ADIMS database (via whatever firewall protection is deemed necessary) gives the GA world huge possibilities for accurate data manipulation without the need to parse a text file (i.e. recover date from a presentation primarily intended for visual/human use). In essence What we are after is data in a defined database-type format, rather than an unstructured and undefined text file which is what we are presently getting. With the raw data we know exactly what data appears where.

This is an ideal state and is possible from a technical point of view. There are, however, other surrounding issues that need more debate, negotiation and agreement by interested stakeholders including us the GA community. These issues are being actively pursued by a number of private flyers and representative organisations, but it is good that we all have an understanding of the issues.

[down&out]

Well I can't get into it. I've only a dial-up and have already waited 5 min for something to happen - so I'm not installing BB just for it.

However, Mike, a little while ago you made an interesting comment

Incidentally, a little nuggett of information I was not aware of. UK AIS only take the French International NOTAM, not the domeswtic series. Therefore if flying to France NOTAM from UKAIS will be good to your destination airfield. For onward flight within France you should check French NOTAM.

Being a bear of simple brains, can you/ anyone explain the physical difference between French International NOTAMs and French "regular?" NOTAMS. Once over the border, surely I need to avoid the same airspace/ be aware of other restrictions irrespective on whether I took off in Blighty or French France?

And therefore , what is the practical difference in content on the UK AIS w.r.t France as apposed to the French system?!?

[Mike Cross]

Not being privy to the way the French classify their NOTAM I can't give you a definitive answer, I was only passing on what I had been told by UK AIS.

ICAO Annex 15 allows for NOTAM to be grouped in Series. Recipients can then decide whether or not they wish to be on the distribution list for particular Series.

The NOTAM Series for the UK are listed in table 3.1.1 in GEN 3.1 of the UK AIP. The French AIP is not yet available on-line so I can't point you at it.

What you get from a briefing service or from UK AIS are not NOTAM, they are Pre-Flight Information Bulletins (PIB's) derived from NOTAM. The briefing service will decide which series are included in the data they use to produce the PIB. For example Series Q (Military Series (Sovereign Bases)) would not be much use in a brief for the UK FIR's.

Examples of things that could be in French domestic NOTAM but not in their International series:-
Regulatory notices relating to licensing of aircraft or pilots.
Facilities at airfields not available for International use.
Obstacles in the approach path at airfields not available for International use.

The EAD is slowly creeping forward. I couldn't get in at all at first, now I can, so they are obviously slowly sorting out the software. The prospect of having centralised access to European AIP's and AIC's is tempting, particularly as and when the electronic AIP becomes a reality (this will present the AIP in a fully searchable electronic format with hyperlinks rather than as images of paper pages). You would be able to download plates as required rather than subscribe to larege quantities of paper and their amendments, most of which you probably do not use.

Time will tell if it becomes a success.

Mike

[down&out]

Mike,

Thanks for your answer - you made some good points about distinguishing the different types of NOTAM. We'll I guess we're all in the dark a bit over the French system.

Interestingly, I do recall last time I flew to France (about 3 weeks ago) the UK AIS system did given me the French NOTAM telling me I couldn't go to Iraq! So- who knows!

D&O:ok:

Also, Mike, I'd just like to add my (belated) thanks to you for all the work you put into the UK AIS system. I'm sure without it we would not have a useable system today. As you say, lets see what happens on this EU system.

[Andrew Sinclair]

I was digging around the EAD and managed to download AIPs from different countries from the Published AIP Management System (PAMS) section of the database. I downloaded the part of the French AIP that deals with NOTAM series that Mike mentioned above and placed it here (http://mysite.freeserve.com/andrew_sinclair/LF_GEN_3_1_en.pdf)

The paragraph in question is 3.1.3.2 a). Left hand text column for French readers, right hand column for English.

The EAD isn't particularly easy to use at first, but once you have played with it a bit it is a very useful source of AIP/AIC & NOTAM/PIB info for all ICAO countries.

If anyone wants anything at any time and can't get it to work send me an e-mail or PM and I will download the document and send it to you or place it on an FTP server with a link like the one above.

I did notice that it is changing now quite rapidly with different screen information and now a disclaimer has appeared so the project team are definately working away there in Stuttgart!

[Mike Cross]

Thanks for that Andrew

Unfortunately the French AIP is particularly vague about the content of their NOTAM series. They only have three, A,B & C

"Series A, Information of a general international scope and concerning more particularly long range flights (for international publication)

Series B, Information of a limited international scope and concerning more particularly other flights (restricted international publication limited to the European region)

Series C, Information of a limited european scope"

I assume that Series C is the one UK AIS do not get and will confirm this, however even if we do have this confirmed it will be of precious little help in working out what we don't get!

If anyone wants a scapegoat for the next few days' weather I'm your man. Having decided to do a few days sailing the forecast has changed to "heavy rain".:{ :yuk:

Mike

[bookworm]

You guys seem to be having more success than me. I'm still unable to get at SDO or INO on my WinXP system. Which OS and browser are you using for your successful INO access, please?

[Andrew Sinclair]

I am a novice in understanding IT, but as far as I know just from looking at the "About" information under the help screens my Browser is IE V6.0 and my Operating System is WinXP.

The way I managed to access the EAD database was just following the download instructions for the Java and then just enetered the site following the links. I had to spend quite a bit of time working our how to use it and I didn't really have much success until I upgraded to broadband (which I had intended to do anyway) then it started to perform better.

I agree with your comment Mike about vague French AIP. I looked at a few different countries and I must say by far and away the most comprehensive was UK IAIP.

[IO540]

Why hasn't someone (e.g. the powers to be) done a website which displays NOTAMs in graphical format, e.g. if there is a radius that would be shown as a circle.

[Andrew Sinclair]

IO540,

This is being discussed at the moment with NATS/AIS and the CAA for UK NOTAMS. Mike Cross is leading the discussions. If you use the search function on this forum you will pick up many hits that may help explain it.

In principle Eurocontrol and UK AIS purchased off the shelf products that don't include this type of GUI. That doesn't stop other external software developers offering a product that does offer this though. They would need to have the Q line released in a recognised database format to produce a trustworthy and efficient product. This is one of the objectives of the ongoing discussions with NATS/AIS and CAA.

Mike knows more of the nitty gritty than I do.

[Mike Cross]

I'm no expert on display systems but I can recognise all sorts of difficulties with graphic display.

Simply drawing a circle on the map is not the answer. NOTAM affecting an entire FIR would put multiple circles over the same area and other NOTAM would cause large numbers of overlapping circles. Some Navaids have ranges of 150 to 250 nm so you can imagine the size of circles they would generate. I don't know how many pages an FIR brief is running at at the moment but it was around the 30 pages mark and we have two FIR's covering the British Isles so that's a hell of a lot of circles.

At the same time the current method is not particularly intuitive. If we could get access to the raw data we could try some alternative approaches.

I'm a user of NavBox Pro and a fan of its interface. You have a resizeable map and simply draw on it using your mouse. The program calculates your weight and balance, fuel burn, does your PLOG, produces a list of frequencies and can do your flight plan. Wouldn't it be great if it also produced a list of NOTAM affecting your route?

I have no VOR or ADF so wouldn't it be nice if I could check a couple of boxes to omit NOTAM relating to them from my brief?

I suspect that the ideal answer will turn out to be some sort of interface where you draw your intended route on the map or draw the outline of the area in which you intend to operate, put in the intended date/time and operating height and it comes back with the relevant data.

Plotting the location and radii of Nav Warnings would be useful in showing "avoid" areas. However a map is two-dimensional while we work in three dimensions so there may not be any need to avoid if you are outside the affected height band.

The hold-up at the moment is the CAA. NATS have no objection to the release of the data it is the CAA (ADAP1) which is holding things up.

I'd be interested in any comments re the above.

Mike

[peg20]

Has anybody looked at this?

http://www.eurocontrol.int/ead/library/software/esi.html

I downloaded the client API kit and tried to run the test client. When it complained that I didn't have a private key, I thought I'd check here first before potentially wasting more of my time.

[bookworm]

peg20

Unfortunately the ESI is designed for system to system connectivity and requires you to have VPN access (or a leased line) to the EAD network. Once you've established that, service fees for connection to the EAD are Euro 10,000 per year and up.

[peg20]

:(

Sorry. I didn't actually bother to read anything before I went and downloaded the first thing in sight. :rolleyes:

Assume I want a system that allows you to plan routes on your home PC, upload it to a GPS-capable palmtop, track your position on aero charts, and get in-flight information about various ATZs you are flying through and altitude changes you must make, etc. based upon your actual position rather than your planned route. Unless there is a system I can afford that does all of this, where can I start looking for the data to build my own?

Thanks

p

[IO540]

peg20

Assume I want a system that allows you to plan routes on your home PC, upload it to a GPS-capable palmtop, track your position on aero charts, and get in-flight information about various ATZs you are flying through and altitude changes you must make, etc. based upon your actual position rather than your planned route.

The first two you can do with various software, Navbox (www.navbox.nl) is a good start. As this is a single-user app, there are some issues you've got to watch with transferring planned routes from one PC to another, so planning the route on the actual laptop is a better idea. (There is a Pocket/PC version too)

The rest (position tracking, airspace info), well you get that to varying degrees with any moving map GPS from Garmin, Skyforce, etc. But AFAIK the only solution which displays the official CAA charts on the moving map is a PDA-based product called Memory Map; it may run on a windoze laptop also, I don't know.

I hope this is what you meant! It isn't relevant to the AIS database, which needs internet access, and there is no easy way to do that while airborne (GSM only works at very low levels and sporadically at best, and is probably illegal to use) but you could probably do it using satellite internet access!!!