SURECHECK checklists, any good?

[2WingsOnMyWagon]

Anyone tryed or use them? Any good?

:ok:

[MLS-12D]

I have a few examples of the "Pro" version. They are not bad, especially for reviewing speeds and procedures if you move around between different types. However, for cockpit use I think that they're too detailed.

I don't have any examples of the abbreviated "Pocket" version, but I think that would be my choice if I were going to get a new checklist.

MLS-12D

P.S. Worth reading:
http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182037-1.html
http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182038-1.html

[Keef]

I use their "pocket" one in the Arrer, and it's reasonable once you correct the errors
:eek:

For example, it recommends fuel selector to "both" for takeoff. I've not yet seen a PA28 with a "both" position, but maybe...

Check the Surecheck against the one in the POH, correct the errors and write in the bits that are missing, and you have a pretty practical checklist.

[Genghis the Engineer]

Always worthy of mention that most operators manuals usually include checklists tailored by people who REALLY knew the type. Cardboard and biros are relatively cheap and I know we've all got computers...

G

[GT]

I looked at some quite a while ago and remember being unimpressed by them. Can't recall exactly why though! Something about the first page(s) I think. They didn't seem particularly better than any other ones around.

Regards, GT.

[Davidt]

Dont like em too much missing! Tried their PA28 180 and TB10 gave the TB10 away, sell you the PA28!

There are better publishers but most do a very limited range Surecheck have the biggest range.

I now use a home made one laminated. If I have cause to change it its on computer and costs a quid at Office World to laminate.

[Fred]

The one for the Arrow III turbo has quite a few mistakes in it, such as some of the starting procedures being in the wrong order and, possibly worse, use of the expression "Full Power" for take-off/go-around. If you slam the throttle fully forward in a PA28RT the turbocharger blows up and a little warning light comes on with a pound-sign on it to remind you that you have just incurred a bill for £3000.

[2WingsOnMyWagon]

Hmmm... not very promising then!!
There seems to be a little gap in the market, I quite like the AFE ones but the range is VERY limited and arnt laminated and the Pooleys ones are awful (silly layout unlaminated and tiny text). Agreed, homemade checklists are probably best but if you need one on short notice or are just to lazy to make it then where do you go? Is there any other companies who produce checklists for light aircraft (SEP and MEP)?

:ok:

[MLS-12D]

There is another place in the US called "CheckMate". I have no experience of their products, but you can find the website here: http://www.checkmateaviation.com/ Supposedly they have checklists "for over 250 models" of aircraft.

[Flyin'Dutch']

MLS-12D wrote:

There is another place in the US called "CheckMate".

Yup, and I have used a few of their's

They are OK but not as good as the home made version.

Homemade does take a bit do doing initially but as most things are a bit generic you can use most of the base as a template.

I usually make a new one when I know that I am going to fly a new type for a little while. Use an unlaminated for a few trips and make adjustments as required. Incorporate those and laminate a few.

I have made it in such a way that one side is normal operating procedures and the reverse is emergency procedures and w&b etc.

Something different to do on those rainy days as well!

FWIW

FD

[DB6]

They do a cracking little book called 'Pocket V speeds' which is great if you fly a few types. Not a checklist but reminds you of all the speeds you can think of for several types. Only found one error so far but haven't flown them all yet.

['India-Mike]

I bought one for use with my PA38 'cos they look good, appear robust. However, agree with previous posts regarding accuracy. Approach speeds are given as 62-67 knots. POH states that it's 62 OR 67 depending on flow strip installation. It's the go-around check that gets me though. "FLAPS - retract one at a time"!!! Yeah we know what they mean but.....

I keep mine in a desk now.

[MLS-12D]

That sounds good. Quick reference to the speeds are what you need the most.

What specific error did you find?

[DB6]

Vr for Warrior II was wrong in kts (but correct in mph). Don't know what it was as I've painted it over. The booklet's actually called 'Aircraft "V" speeds' from 1998 and has 26 aircraft from C150 to Seneca 1. Good value, as our antipodean cousins would say.

[ratsarrse]

There are a selection of homemade type checklists here:

http://www.deltabyte.com/captaindave/capdave.html

Might be worth a look - you can play around with them and adapt them as much as you want...

[Chimbu chuckles]

Whats wrong with pneumonics, several classics spring to mind but you can make up your own that will easily cover any SEP you're likely to fly.

IMO written checklists are not a great idea.

Mechanical checklists are a different matter entirely and I have one in my Bonanza because it's flown by a variety of experience levels within our Aeroclub. It's a tab type and is used in conjunction with a scan..ie one tab has 'Mixture, Magnetos,Prop'. You stop in the runup bay, check full rich/mag check and cycle the prop then flip the tab up to cover those items as checked...which exposes some items that are done pre landing.

This is not a great piccy but you can see the checklist on the glareshield. I'll get a better piccy this weekend and post it.

SAFGO Checklist (http://www.fototime.com/{FF2E1C3A-B3A9-43AF-86D4-F8DE31102A07}/picture.JPG)

They are a brilliant checklist. In Talair we had one, with type specific checks in all the company aircraft BN2/B55/C402/DHC6/E110 and it was not unusual to fly (always single pilot I might add) all or most of those aircraft in a single day occasionally. Even the DHC8 had a more sophisticated version with slides that folded out and up to expose a list with individual tabs. Later I flew DHC7 & F28 with the identical Slide type checklists.

I found the one in my A36 gathering dust in a flying school...they didn't want it so I grabbed it and printed up a type specific checklist from the POH and glued it over the generic rubbish that was on it, covered with clear contact it works a treat.

IMO written booklet style checklists in SEP have become prevalent because of flying schools aping what they think airlines do...and too often they are used as 'do lists' rather than 'checklists'...let alone becoming crammed full of penned in 'usefull' info as a way of avoiding reading the POH the night before flying a infrequently flown type.

An exception would be emergency checklists...I have an A5 laminated booklet with all the abnormal stuff in (+ a lot of other stuff) which lives stowed outboard of the pilot's seat where it can be accessed instantly...if the gear malfuctions, or such like, you can hold somewhere quiet and refresh your memory before carrying out in actions...or you can refresh your memory as you fly along on a/p on a quiet sector.

Chuck.

[Circuit Basher]

Thanks to some links posted on PPRuNe in the last week, I've finally got round to (95%, anyway ;) ) completing a 'shirt pocket' style checklist for the Fuji which I fly. I have not managed to got to the airport (55 miles away!) to check the POH for Actual Weight, Best Rate of Climb Speed, Best Angle of Climb Speed.

I've tinkered with some of the sequences of checks to tally with local procedures, etc. If anyone wishes to use it as a basis for further developments (based on their aircraft / POH), feel free to do so. If you like it, then I won't reject a pint from you at the next bash!! :)

Fuji FA200 Draft Checklist (http://www.msnusers.com/CircuitBasher/Documents/KARI%20Checklist%2Edoc)

[Chimbu chuckles]

The better piccy I promised...years ago at Talair we called them SAFGO checklists, I have no idea if that's what they're really called by the manufacturer.

I've probably got 6000 hrs using these checklists and they're brilliant.

I heard years ago that they are not made anymore due to some stupid Liability suit...anyone know?

Two guys I can think of landed 402s wheels up despite the checklist but that is not a condemnation of the checklist!

SAFGO Checklist (http://www.fototime.com/{62777AF6-84DB-4A82-A5E3-66F5356A4E19}/picture.JPG)

Like a written one they are only as good as the nut behind the wheel.

Chuck.